Thank you, my explaination was much less informative and likely come across wrong....in any case I know someone over at ardupilot put together an excellent flash 'demo' where you can move around a little drone while adjusting the p I and d values for its autopilot. if I come across it again I will post the link. On Jun 29, 2014 12:37 AM, "Florin Mingireanu" <florin.mingireanu82@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: > Vicente, > > PID stands for proportional-integrative-derivative and represents a > control loop feedback mechanism. > > Arduino is a microcontroller on which the PID can be implemented to > maintain a variable to a setpoint. > > Florin > > > > On Sun, Jun 29, 2014 at 1:16 AM, Vicente Alvero Zambrano < > vicente_alvero_14@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > >> Certainly it is a good option. >> Now we have to choose which is the best. If arduino or PID. >> Please ask all people collaboration available to design this oven. >> >> ------------------------------ >> Date: Sat, 28 Jun 2014 14:40:38 -0700 >> >> Subject: [SS2S-Main] Re: temperature controller with arduino >> From: rawliquid@xxxxxxxxx >> To: sugarshot@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> >> >> I noticed the other day that there is actually already a pid library for >> arduino, as well as an autotuning library....not sure if anyone has started >> programming yet >> On Jun 28, 2014 9:37 AM, "Vicente Alvero Zambrano" < >> vicente_alvero_14@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: >> >> Hi Tim, >> Any news? >> >> ------------------------------ >> From: vicente_alvero_14@xxxxxxxxxxx >> To: sugarshot@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> Subject: [SS2S-Main] Re: temperature controller with arduino >> Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2014 11:06:02 +0200 >> >> Sorry for the delay Tim, I've been busy these days. I'll try to answer >> your questions. >> >> 1) What is the weight of the heaviest item you envision heating? >> >> In principle, the heaviest element we want to cure is the nosecone. I do >> not know exactly the weight of this piece because it is not yet defined. >> Say, as long long, 3 kg. >> >> >> 2) What is the specific heat of the materials used? >> >> >> I do not know the specific heat of fiberglass fiber, but maybe we can >> make an approximation here: >> >> http://www.matweb.com/search/DataSheet.aspx?MatGUID=462fd1da8ad245b2ad40093889016448 >> >> >> 3) What is the maximum temperature required? >> >> >> With the current resin we are using, the maximum curing temperature is 80 >> ° C. >> >> But we have used resins with a maximum curing temperature of 200 ° C. >> >> >> 4) What is the maximum rate of temperature rise per min or per hour? >> >> >> Approximately, the temperature rise is usually 10 ° C / h >> >> >> 5) Will you be doing this work in Europe? I need to know what type of >> power source you have available. Voltage and Amperage on the circuit you >> plan to use. >> >> >> In Spain, the voltage is 220V with a frequency of 50Hz >> ------------------------------ >> From: tyoung489@xxxxxxxxx >> Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2014 00:26:26 -0700 >> Subject: [SS2S-Main] Re: temperature controller with arduino >> To: sugarshot@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> >> Vicente, >> >> To attempt to answer your questions I need some information. >> >> 1) What is the weight of the heaviest item you envision heating? >> >> 2) What is the specific heat of the materials used? >> 3) What is the maximum temperature required? >> 4) What is the maximum rate of temperature rise per min or per hour? >> 5) Will you be doing this work in Europe? I need to know what type of >> power source you have available. Voltage and Amperage on the circuit you >> plan to use. >> >> You gave 100 C as the max temperature required. I could not find any >> epoxy systems that recommend such a low curing temperature. >> I see 120-C to 180-C for Epoxy, 150-C to 180-C for Phenolics, and up to >> 290-C for Polyimides >> >> For Epoxy I see 1-C / Min to 5-C / Min rise. >> >> This is 60-C to 300-C per hour. This is very different from the >> example you gave. >> >> example: >> 20 ° C to 100 ° C by increments of 20 ° C / h. >> 5 hours at 100 ° C. >> 100 ° C at 20 ° C with a decrease of 20 ° C. >> Ideally develop a graphical interface to vary these parameters at will. >> >> >> On Sun, Jun 22, 2014 at 2:47 AM, Vicente Alvero Zambrano < >> vicente_alvero_14@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: >> >> Hi Tim, >> >> Unfortunately, we can not spend $ 180 on this system. On the other hand, >> given that the PID is the best option, we can opt for this. >> >> We have a PID we bought last year. PID is REX-C700. I also have a >> thermocouple type K 2 meters in length. So we can use this. >> >> Now the question is, what fan?, What resistance?, What power? >> >> Opinions?, Comments? >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> From: tyoung489@xxxxxxxxx >> Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2014 21:04:29 -0700 >> >> Subject: [SS2S-Main] Re: temperature controller with arduino >> To: sugarshot@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> >> >> Hi, >> >> Depending on how you locate the heaters you may find that you'll have >> problems maintaining uniform temperature throughout the oven with your >> planned dimensions of 2 x0.5 x 0.5 m (Free). Long oven shapes are more >> difficult to keep at a uniform temperature. Long oven can be beneficial >> if you have a process that requires different temperatures along the route >> through the oven tunnel. In a tunnel oven you are normally applying spot >> heat directly or via infrared. >> >> In a convection oven, like what you want, the heat is applied indirectly >> via the surrounding medium, air in this case. Normally the heat source is >> not directly in the area with the product your heating. You want some heat >> barrier (wood, steel, or aluminum plate) between it & the product to avoid >> spot heating. Larger ovens would use a supply fan with additional >> stirring fans to maintain uniform temperature. >> >> Just for consideration. This could all be inside your plywood & foam >> box. Heater section with stir fan(s) -> Aluminum plate barrier to direct >> heating -> oven space with stir fan(s). Also you can often get lower cost >> fans if the motor is mounted outside the oven with only the blade in the >> heated space. >> >> The control portion of your job requires nothing unique that requires new >> research or development efforts. This is a straight forward case of >> application engineering for this cure oven. >> >> It seems to me that with the Arduino you're starting from scratch to >> re-develop the wheel. This may be fun but is unnecessary with the >> abundance of low cost, off the shelf controllers, & software available. >> Granted these weren't available 20-years ago but neither was the Arduino. >> The design, testing, & debugging of the software interface for the >> controller is where you'll be spending or wasting your time, depending upon >> the results. >> >> The BCS-460 is a fully debugged Temperature Controller with Everything >> you want & much more. $180. >> Graphical, Web, & Smart Phone Software Interface. >> 8 Programmable outputs each with 8-stages. >> 4 Sensor inputs >> You can pre-program & also interact with the settings on the fly. >> http://www.embeddedcontrolconcepts.com >> *Graphi**cs Screenshots* >> http://www.embeddedcontrolconcepts.com/screenshots.html >> >> The BCS-460 has 4 temp sensor inputs. These are any ntc 10k ohm >> thermistor that you can get 100 for $8 plus shipping online or $0.75ea plus >> shipping from SparkFun. >> For your curing operation you will want to know the temperature of the >> part, not just the oven temperature. What is often done is to use a scrap >> or dummy piece of what you are curing & embed the sensor at the spot that >> the temperature is most critical to sense >> >> >> *BCS-460 Controller Graphical, Web, & Smart Phone Software* *Interface* >> (These will do what you ask of them. Don't get tripped-up by what they're >> called. Curing a composite part is less sophisticated than running a >> Brewery) >> >> https://www.brewershardware.com/BCS-460-Brewery-Control-System.html >> *iPhone Interface Demo* >> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4r9hCVYSt2Y >> *Software Documentation* >> http://wiki.embeddedcc.com/index.php/Main_Page >> >> *Other Electronics* *starting around $15* (some of these have the >> ability to output to your computer some come with software) >> >> http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1311.R1.TR8.TRC1.A0.H1.Xpid+temp&_nkw=pid+temperature+controller&_sacat=0&_from=R40 >> >> >> >> >> On Sat, Jun 21, 2014 at 4:02 AM, Vicente Alvero Zambrano < >> vicente_alvero_14@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: >> >> Hi, >> >> The main idea is to made a home oven from plywood and foam insulation. I >> planned dimensions of 2 x0.5 x 0.5 m (Free). With these dimensions we can >> cure any parts necessary for SS2S project. Recall that the largest piece so >> far is the nosecone (1507 mm). >> For smaller piece, and in order not to waste energy, I have thought the >> manufacture of a partition. >> >> You're right about the fans. I'm sure I can get some free fan oven, as >> well as resistence. >> >> The objective of using arduino, is the possibility of developing a >> graphical interface in which to determine the temperature ranges >> ------------------------------ >> Subject: [SS2S-Main] Re: temperature controller with arduino >> From: tyoung489@xxxxxxxxx >> Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2014 17:30:38 -0700 >> To: sugarshot@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> >> >> As much fun as it is to play with Arduinos it's a waste of time & money. >> Programmable PID Temperature Controller with single or dual sensors can >> be purchased on eBay for $15-$60. >> >> Where will you be placing the temperature sensor for the controller, >> embedded in the part or on the surface? >> Or are you going to try to run the oven at the desired temperature and >> guesstimate the time it takes for the part to equilibrate? I believe that >> would problematic and take longer to achieve your cure. I think that the >> manufacture of the composite materials should be able & more than willing >> to provide you with general propose curing methods & procedures. >> >> Are you building your own over with strip heaters, fans, etc? Or are you >> planing to interface the controller and fans to an existing oven? >> >> For convection circulation you only need constant speed fans and if you >> plan on using axial flow computer type fans be aware most are rated to 60-C >> or 70-C. >> You can get 105-C rated fans but not from an old computer. sofasco.com >> is one of many places you can get them. You could use standard fans but it >> anyone's guess on how long they'll last. >> If the parts are small you can buy small electric convection ovens sold >> as Toster/Pizza ovens. >> Check Walmart, Best Buy, Target, eBay, Amazon. >> >> Sent by Timothy Young >> iPad >> >> >> On Jun 20, 2014, at 4:01 PM, Vicente Alvero Zambrano < >> vicente_alvero_14@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: >> >> Florin that's perfect. >> The system must be simple (as cheap as possible). With a source of >> heating (resistance) and several computer fans to circulate the air. >> Arduino must be able to control the temperature (using the resistance and >> the fan) according to a predefined schedule. A program is for example: >> 20 ° C to 100 ° C by increments of 20 ° C / h. >> 5 hours at 100 ° C. >> 100 ° C at 20 ° C with a decrease of 20 ° C. >> Ideally develop a graphical interface to vary these parameters at will. >> >> ------------------------------ >> Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2014 01:32:37 +0300 >> Subject: [SS2S-Main] Re: temperature controller with arduino >> From: florin.mingireanu82@xxxxxxxxx >> To: sugarshot@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> >> I can help with the temperature controller but I would need more precise >> specifications: like temperature range, control "band" etc. >> >> >> On Fri, Jun 20, 2014 at 10:16 PM, Vicente Alvero Zambrano < >> vicente_alvero_14@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: >> >> Hi, >> Anyone know how to make a temperature controller with arduino to make a >> home oven to cure composite? >> The idea is to monitor several computer fans and thermal resistances. >> Must be able to follow a cure profile and decreased with increases in >> temperature curing. >> Any volunteer? >> >> Cheers >> Vicente Alvero >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Florin Mingireanu >> Romanian Space Agency >> Str. Mendeleev 21-25, et. 5, sector 1, 010362 Bucuresti, ROMANIA >> office tel. +40-21-316.87.22; +40-21-316.87.23; >> cell: +40-757-768971 (primary phone) >> fax +40-21-312.88.04 >> florin.mingireanu@xxxxxxx >> http://www.rosa.ro >> >> >> >> > > > -- > Florin Mingireanu > Romanian Space Agency > Str. Mendeleev 21-25, et. 5, sector 1, 010362 Bucuresti, ROMANIA > office tel. +40-21-316.87.22; +40-21-316.87.23; > cell: +40-757-768971 (primary phone) > fax +40-21-312.88.04 > florin.mingireanu@xxxxxxx > http://www.rosa.ro >