[SS2S-Main] Re: temperature controller with arduino

  • From: Tim young <tyoung489@xxxxxxxxx>
  • To: "sugarshot@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <sugarshot@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2014 00:26:26 -0700


To attempt to answer your questions I need some information.

1) What is the weight of the heaviest item you envision heating?

2) What is the specific heat of the materials used?

3) What is the maximum temperature required?

4) What is the maximum rate of temperature rise per min or per hour?

5) Will you be doing this work in Europe?   I need to know what type of
power source you have available. Voltage and Amperage on the circuit you
plan to use.

You gave 100 C as the max temperature required. I could not find any epoxy
systems that recommend such a low curing temperature.

I see 120-C to 180-C for Epoxy, 150-C to 180-C for Phenolics, and up to
290-C for Polyimides

For Epoxy I see 1-C / Min to 5-C / Min rise.

This is 60-C to 300-C per hour.   This is very different from the example
you gave.

20 ° C to 100 ° C by increments of 20 ° C / h.
5 hours at 100 ° C.
100 ° C at 20 ° C with a decrease of 20 ° C.
Ideally develop a graphical interface to vary these parameters at will.

On Sun, Jun 22, 2014 at 2:47 AM, Vicente Alvero Zambrano <
vicente_alvero_14@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> Hi Tim,
> Unfortunately, we can not spend $ 180 on this system. On the other hand,
> given that the PID is the best option, we can opt for this.
> We have a PID we bought last year. PID is REX-C700. I also have a
> thermocouple type K 2 meters in length. So we can use this.
> Now the question is, what fan?, What resistance?, What power?
> Opinions?, Comments?
> ------------------------------
> From: tyoung489@xxxxxxxxx
> Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2014 21:04:29 -0700
> Subject: [SS2S-Main] Re: temperature controller with arduino
> To: sugarshot@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Hi,
> Depending on how you locate the heaters you may find that you'll have
> problems maintaining uniform temperature throughout the oven with your
> planned dimensions of 2 x0.5 x 0.5 m (Free).  Long oven shapes are more
> difficult to keep at a uniform temperature.   Long oven can be beneficial
> if you have a process that requires different temperatures along the route
> through the oven tunnel.   In a tunnel oven you are normally applying spot
> heat directly or via infrared.
> In a convection oven, like what you want, the heat is applied indirectly
> via the surrounding medium, air in this case.   Normally the heat source is
> not directly in the area with the product your heating. You want some heat
> barrier (wood, steel, or aluminum plate) between it & the product to avoid
> spot heating.   Larger ovens would use a supply fan with additional
> stirring fans to maintain uniform temperature.
> Just for consideration.  This could all be inside your plywood & foam box.
> Heater section with stir fan(s) -> Aluminum plate barrier to direct heating
> -> oven space with stir fan(s).   Also you can often get lower cost fans if
> the motor is mounted outside the oven with only the blade in the heated
> space.
> The control portion of your job requires nothing unique that requires new
> research or development efforts.   This is a straight forward case of
> application engineering for this cure oven.
> It seems to me that with the Arduino you're starting from scratch to
> re-develop the wheel.  This may be fun but is unnecessary with the
> abundance of low cost, off the shelf controllers, & software available.
> Granted these weren't available 20-years ago but neither was the Arduino.
> The design, testing,  & debugging of the software interface for the
> controller is where you'll be spending or wasting your time, depending upon
> the results.
> The BCS-460 is a fully debugged Temperature Controller with Everything you
> want & much more. $180.
> Graphical, Web, & Smart Phone Software Interface.
> 8 Programmable outputs each with 8-stages.
> 4 Sensor inputs
> You can pre-program & also interact with the settings on the fly.
> http://www.embeddedcontrolconcepts.com
> *Graphi**cs Screenshots*
> http://www.embeddedcontrolconcepts.com/screenshots.html
> The BCS-460 has 4 temp sensor inputs.   These are any ntc 10k ohm
> thermistor that you can get 100 for $8 plus shipping online or $0.75ea plus
> shipping from SparkFun.
> For your curing operation you will want to know the temperature of the
> part, not just the oven temperature.   What is often done is to use a scrap
> or dummy piece of what you are curing & embed the sensor at the spot that
> the temperature is most critical to sense
> *BCS-460 Controller  Graphical, Web, & Smart Phone Software* *Interface*
> (These will do what you ask of them. Don't get tripped-up by what they're
> called. Curing a composite part is less sophisticated than running a
> Brewery)
> https://www.brewershardware.com/BCS-460-Brewery-Control-System.html
> *iPhone Interface Demo*
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4r9hCVYSt2Y
> *Software Documentation*
> http://wiki.embeddedcc.com/index.php/Main_Page
> *Other Electronics* *starting around $15* (some of these have the ability
> to output to your computer some come with software)
> http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1311.R1.TR8.TRC1.A0.H1.Xpid+temp&_nkw=pid+temperature+controller&_sacat=0&_from=R40
> On Sat, Jun 21, 2014 at 4:02 AM, Vicente Alvero Zambrano <
> vicente_alvero_14@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> Hi,
> The main idea is to made a home oven from plywood and foam insulation. I
> planned dimensions of 2 x0.5 x 0.5 m (Free). With these dimensions we can
> cure any parts necessary for SS2S project. Recall that the largest piece so
> far is the nosecone (1507 mm).
> For smaller piece, and in order not to waste energy, I have thought the
> manufacture of a partition.
> You're right about the fans. I'm sure I can get some free fan oven, as
> well as resistence.
> The objective of using arduino, is the possibility of developing a
> graphical interface in which to determine the temperature ranges
> ------------------------------
> Subject: [SS2S-Main] Re: temperature controller with arduino
> From: tyoung489@xxxxxxxxx
> Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2014 17:30:38 -0700
> To: sugarshot@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> As much fun as it is to play with Arduinos it's a waste of time & money.
> Programmable PID Temperature Controller with single or dual sensors can be
> purchased on eBay for $15-$60.
> Where will you be placing the temperature sensor for the controller,
> embedded in the part or on the surface?
> Or are you going to try to run the oven at the desired temperature and
> guesstimate the time it takes for the part to equilibrate? I believe that
> would problematic and take longer to achieve your cure. I think that the
> manufacture of the composite materials should be able & more than willing
> to provide you with general propose curing methods & procedures.
> Are you building your own over with strip heaters, fans, etc? Or are you
> planing to interface the controller and fans to an existing oven?
> For convection circulation you only need constant speed fans and if you
> plan on using axial flow computer type fans be aware most are rated to 60-C
> or  70-C.
> You can get 105-C rated fans but not from an old computer. sofasco.com is
> one of many places you can get them. You could use standard fans but it
> anyone's guess on how long they'll last.
> If the parts are small you can buy small electric convection ovens sold as
> Toster/Pizza ovens.
> Check Walmart, Best Buy, Target, eBay, Amazon.
> Sent by Timothy Young
>                iPad
> On Jun 20, 2014, at 4:01 PM, Vicente Alvero Zambrano <
> vicente_alvero_14@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>  Florin that's perfect.
> The system must be simple (as cheap as possible). With a source of heating
> (resistance) and several computer fans to circulate the air. Arduino must
> be able to control the temperature (using the resistance and the fan)
> according to a predefined schedule. A program is for example:
> 20 ° C to 100 ° C by increments of 20 ° C / h.
> 5 hours at 100 ° C.
> 100 ° C at 20 ° C with a decrease of 20 ° C.
> Ideally develop a graphical interface to vary these parameters at will.
> ------------------------------
> Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2014 01:32:37 +0300
> Subject: [SS2S-Main] Re: temperature controller with arduino
> From: florin.mingireanu82@xxxxxxxxx
> To: sugarshot@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> I can help with the temperature controller but I would need more precise
> specifications: like temperature range, control "band" etc.
> On Fri, Jun 20, 2014 at 10:16 PM, Vicente Alvero Zambrano <
> vicente_alvero_14@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> Hi,
> Anyone know how to make a temperature controller with arduino to make a
> home oven to cure composite?
> The idea is to monitor several computer fans and thermal resistances. Must
> be able to follow a cure profile and decreased with increases in
> temperature curing.
> Any volunteer?
> Cheers
> Vicente Alvero
> --
> Florin Mingireanu
> Romanian Space Agency
> Str. Mendeleev 21-25, et. 5, sector 1, 010362 Bucuresti, ROMANIA
> office tel. +40-21-316.87.22; +40-21-316.87.23;
> cell: +40-757-768971 (primary phone)
> fax +40-21-312.88.04
> florin.mingireanu@xxxxxxx
> http://www.rosa.ro

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