[jhb] Re: IVAO and Unwelcome ATC

  • From: Gerry Winskill <gwinsk@xxxxxxx>
  • To: jhb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  • Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2007 19:09:14 +0100

Paul,
I had thought of trying what you suggest, in effect declining to be controlled when that is an unreal situation. It will also be easier to pass this on via text, rather than join his channel and get into a one to one situation. The need to announce intentions on Unicom is a good idea. I don't know that it's lack of confidence, in fact I suspect quite the opposite. I found it bizarre that Scottish control should insist on giving clearances, taxi instructions etc, at two fields, at the same time; Belfast City and Aldergrove. Whilst at the same time controlling aircraft in flight, half of which weren't in his zone.

Gerry Winskill


Paul Reynolds wrote:

Generally a thorny issue.

There are those who argue why join a ATC controlled environment if you
aren't going to talk to the controllers. I would argue it is also a virtual
flying environment and communication with fellow pilots when appropriate
also enhances the realism, as does having aircraft not under their control
within the sector enhance it for controllers.

If your intentions are clear and your flightplan should show you to be VFR
and local then Scottish Control should have no problem with that.  I would
also go so far as saying you are something he needs to consider and act upon
when vectoring traffic but should not need to have to take control.  If he
insists on controlling all traffic in Scotland then I would suggest it is
his lack of confidence in his own abilities that drives him to it - keeping
IFR and VFR seperated is one of the challenges controllers have to deal with
and something he may not be comfortable with. Having you 'on channel' will
give him a comfort zone, he can then vector that slow moving aircraft away
from his fast moving heavy metal if he needs to.

My personal postion would be to txt him stating clearly your intentions to
remain VFR at or below XXXX within the boundaries of the island.  You will
squawk 7000, as is recgonised practice within the UK and will transmit
intentions to traffic on 122.80 as is standard practice.

Further, should Scottish Control tell you to contact them tell them politely
you are outside their airspace, Ronaldsway is in the EGTM_CTR sector in
IVAO. Therefore any traffic would naturally expect you to be broadcasting
intentions on 122.80 where EGTM_CTR are not present or not with EGNS.

If you don't want to do this then try e-mailing Gareth Richardson (Division
Director of the UK Division - gb-dir@xxxxxxxxx) and seek clarification.

I'd draw attention to some of the issues raised here, including the support
for newcomers to ease them in through VFR to gain confidence and trasition
into controlled airspace.  Hopefully things can be resolved amicably if
handled with care.

Paul

-----Original Message-----
From: jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf
Of Gerry Winskill
Sent: 10 September 2007 18:52
To: jhb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [jhb] IVAO and Unwelcome ATC


Is there a mechanism for feeding comments and requests into IVAO?

I ask because just as I was about to join, for the odd 45 mins of local
VFR flight in the IOM, I noticed that Scottish Control had just switched
on. Past experience suggests he will contact me, insisting on giving
clearances etc, despite my being VFR and despite my being outside his
zone. When I mentioned this to him, a couple of weeks ago, he said that
if London Control isn't covered then he handles this as well.  So I've
logged off. Why? Because it's nice to have the occasional low profile
flight, without the sound of RT intruding into other rooms. It's also
pleasant to be able to fly without reference to ATC, when the real world
rules would be permitting this. If RW pilots could only fly under ATC
control, then I guess there'd be fewer of them.

I appreciate the chap might mean well and might like to talk to flyers
but a look at IVAPEye shows that he has 4 IFR flights in his area, or
shortly to be in it.. If pilots, quite reasonably, have to obey the
rules, then the same criteria should apply to controllers. Another very
valid reason for not being enthusiastic about his unneccesary
involvement is that we've assured our less experienced members that VFR
flights, outside controlled airspace, will leave them not having to
worry about ATC contacts until they feel they are ready. At the moment
that should bear the caveat; provided it's in the South of England,
where the London Controller reacts normally to VFR flights.

Any suggestions on who I might tactfully put this view to? Or reasons
why others think I'm being unreasonable.

Gerry Winskill





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