I didn't get the original post from Gerry so I don't know what this is about. Seems my mail is going through a crisis of existentialism as your post below (sent at 2015) didn't arrive until 1125 today. I don't profess to being able to interpret Gerry's letter from the content of Frank's reply but I assume some misunderstanding between himself and ATC. All I would like to say here is that there are a lot of newcomers to IVAO on both sides. JHB pilots are new and it is inevitable that mistakes will be made. In this case you hope ATC will be sympathetic and understanding and help you out. If the situation is reversed then I hope pilots show equal understanding. Asking one side to play ball can easily come back to you with a vengeance. bones -----Original Message----- From: jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of franklyn fisher Sent: 10 September 2007 20:15 To: jhb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [jhb] Re: IVAO and Unwelcome ATC Gerry The IVAO forums, might be a good place. Not much point asking pilots to play ball, if the controllers are not. If I am in contact with my instructor tomorrow night, I will ask the question. Tactfully. FF