Blank lines are meaningful to the Bookshare tools, but at some point it's possible that additional blank lines are being discarded. They may be lost when the file is converted to the intermediate file format (possibly XML) which is used to create both the DAISY and BRF books. The reason I say blank lines aren't meaningless is because of what I have noticed happening in the HTML file which can be unpacked along with the DAISY files. Here is an example of a page from the first book I submitted which does not have blank lines at the top and bottom. The text comes from the bottom of page 9 and the top of page 10. As you can see, I stripped the header. All of the headers came out garbled because, from what my Wife said, they were in a smaller, thinner font and printed in green. ---------- like a freight train, and somebody in it talkin? on a phone.? 9 [Page Break] She turned to the small crowd that had rushed out of the Main ---------- Now, here is the same text in the HTML file. ---------- like a freight train, and somebody in it talkin' on a phone.? 10 She turned to the small crowd that had rushed out of the Main ---------- The Stripper recognized the page number for page 10 properly, but when the page number in the tag was added back to page 10 in the HTML file, it was attached to the front of the first paragraph on that page. Now here's an example from the second book I submitted which had a blank line at the top and bottom of the page. As you can see, I've stripped the header again. ---------- and the word spreading through the Grill like so much 11 [Page Break] wildfire, and spilling out the door and up Main Street ---------- Now here's that same text from the HTML file. ---------- and the word spreading through the Grill like so much 12 wildfire, and spilling out the door and up Main Street ---------- This time the page number from the DAISY tag was placed on a line by itself rather than attaching it to the first paragraph. Again you can see that the page number is moved to the top of the page because of the way the tools process page numbers. Granted two examples aren't much evidence to go on, especially when someone else validated the two books, but I've seen the problem with page numbers in many HTML files, and none of the books I've worked on have this problem other than my first book which doesn't contain a blank line at the top and bottom of each page. Unless someone can provide an example where not having the blank line at the top and bottom of the page doesn't cause the error, I'll continue to believe that the lack of the blank lines is the reason for the page number bug. Gerald -----Original Message----- From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Sarah Van Oosterwijck Sent: Tuesday, November 29, 2005 3:53 PM To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: opinions on blank pages wanted Blank lines are meaningless to the bookshare system. You could put 0 blank lines before and after the page number or dozens and the system would view it the same way. The first and last lines on a page are considered possible headers or footers no matter their placement. A header is the first single line of text on a page followed by a blank line. A footer is the last single line of text on a page when it is preceded by a blank line. The number of blank lines before a header or after a footer don't matter. The header or footer is stripped if (1) it is a page number, (2) it is text that repeats on several other pages. Page numbers currently only appear in DAISY books when read with the right software, but in the future, BookShare has informed this list, that will most likely change. They have indicated that they want to improve access so that braille readers and users of other software might see the page numbers as well. We just don't know when or how this will be accomplished. I have started working on a tip about this, but I am always trying to be too thorough, and I try to write in a way that won't confuse. The result is that I am very slow. Sarah Van Oosterwijck Assistive Technology Trainer http://home.earthlink.net/~netentity ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cindy" <popularplace@xxxxxxxxx> To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Tuesday, November 29, 2005 2:53 PM Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: opinions on blank pages wanted > Pratik, > > Is there any danger that by having the page number on > the new line right after the page break that it will > be deleted by the stripper? I've been leaving a blank > line before and after my page numbers, whether they > appear on the top or the bottom of the page--likewise, > before the page's text. IS this not necessary? > > Cindy > >> >> At the top of the blank page write the pae nmber and >> press enter twice. So >> your page would appears as follows. >> >> Page break >> page number >> new line >> new line >> page break >> >> This will allow the pagination to continue. >> >> Pratik >> >> >> >> Pratik Patel >> Director, CUNY Assistive Technology Services (CATS) >> The City University of New York >> pratik.patel@xxxxxxxxxxx >> >> >> >> _____ >> >> From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> [mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On >> Behalf Of Estelnalissi >> Sent: Monday, November 28, 2005 11:46 PM >> To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> Subject: [bksvol-discuss] opinions on blank pages >> wanted >> >> >> ~Hello Everyone, >> >> Sometimes in the book I'm validating there's a blank >> page after a chapter. >> Page breaks are there one just below the other. I've >> been placing a blank >> line under the page break, writing, blank page on >> the second line and >> leaving another blank line beneath. I thought the >> stripper might delete my 2 >> words. >> >> The other question is whether you think I should >> write a page number on the >> page. That's an oxymoron if ever there was one, >> because the blank page would >> now contain the words blank page and after a skipped >> line, a page number. >> Some blank, huh? >> >> In the book, that blank doesn't have a printed >> number, but it has been taken >> in to account on the following page where the >> chapter begins. for example, >> last page of chapter is 80, blank page, first page >> of next chapter is 82. >> >> I'm asking because I have this bleary notion we're >> supposed to account for >> all pages. I'm afraid if I don't write a notice >> that there's a blank page >> and assign it's number, the uploading program might >> think I've left pages >> missing. >> >> Is that extra page break enough to account for the >> blank page? >> >> I've been using my judgment on this detail, but >> wonder what the rest of you >> do or if there's a right way to process these blank >> pages. >> >> Thank you in advance. >> >> Always With Love, >> >> Lissi >> > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! Music Unlimited > Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. > http://music.yahoo.com/unlimited/ > To unsubscribe from this list send a blank Email to > bksvol-discuss-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > put the word 'unsubscribe' by itself in the subject line. To get a list > of available commands, put the word 'help' by itself in the subject line. > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.1.362 / Virus Database: 267.13.10/186 - Release Date: > 11/29/2005 > > To unsubscribe from this list send a blank Email to bksvol-discuss-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx put the word 'unsubscribe' by itself in the subject line. To get a list of available commands, put the word 'help' by itself in the subject line. To unsubscribe from this list send a blank Email to bksvol-discuss-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx put the word 'unsubscribe' by itself in the subject line. To get a list of available commands, put the word 'help' by itself in the subject line.