I had a top CHAMPION who had poor hips. She was magnificent.it would have been
a shame not to breed her..She produced a select CHAMPION..Alan Sandler owned
her..She never produced one lame dog
On July 30, 2015, at 11:58 AM, Evan Ginsburg <dmarc-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
We had a spectacular dog call Champion Asgard's Dragon-Slayer. He had a
fragmented/fractured coronoid process. In truth the process never completed.
There was a piece of the coronoid bone that never attached.
We asked if we should have it removed, and the vet said he would have to
chisel it out, as it was that solid with cartilage. We had sold him to the
Gradys and so we refunded the money and took him back. We did campaign him, but
never used him at stud. He was a litter mate to Champion Dakota and Champion
Destiny. Today, knowing what I have learned in 45 years of breeding, I would
have used Dragon-Slayer at stud.
It is never a good idea to discard a dog for one issue, and we would lose a lot
in the breed by doing so.
AOF, and the rest are great tools to be used in considering a breeding program.
The standard is another tool. The best of all is your own brain.
fragmented/fractured coronoid process
Evan
-----Original Message-----
From: Carolyn Martello <marhaven@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: proudk911 <proudk911@xxxxxxxxx>; cashe90 <cashe90@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc: showgsd-l <showgsd-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thu, Jul 30, 2015 8:39 am
Subject: [ SHOWGSD-L ] Re: DJD ...??
We had a bitch many years ago when OFA first started doing a lot of elbows that
was
diagnosed with DJD.
IF I had it to do over again and knew then what I know now about her... I would
have likely
bred her....at least in that particular case.
She was the only female in a nice litter. Her elbow joints were absolutely
perfect!
Our Vet was very experienced at lots of X-rays and he was NOT HAPPY with OFA on
that.
He and other Vets felt they were perfect and UC Davis saw nothing wrong with
the joints.
ONLY thing we could see was about two inches down on her actual leg bone ( NOT
her elbow JOINT) was a tiny "pimple" you could hardly see. They called that
DJD!
Co owner had her spayed and worked her in Agility all of her adult life.....and
X-rayed
again I think at 6 yrs. and again at 10 years and her elbow joints were still
perfect.
Carolyn marhaven@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
www.marhaven.com
From: showgsd-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:showgsd-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of Jen Proud
Subject: [ SHOWGSD-L ] Re: DJD
When a dog is listed as having "just" DJD, it is caused over 90% by FCP
(fragmented/fractured coronoid process). The DJD is the end result, as the
FCP most often dissolves/is reabsorbed over time. When FCP is specifically
listed on an OFA report, it is due to the FCP either being: 1) new enough to
not be dissolved, or 2) a large enough piece that it won't be reabsorbed by the
body.
The verdict is still out as to the cause of FCP, as it can be both a
conformational defect/genetic weakness, or injury/trauma to the elbow.
However, USUALLY, when a dog has only ONE DJD elbow, it is not passed on as
strongly as when a dog has TWO DJD elbows (of any grade). When a dog has TWO
DJD elbows, it is more likely genetic than not, and the proof is in the
progeny; perhaps not in the first generation, but if not carefully bred farther
on, does show its ugly face on a regular basis.
I have never knowingly bred to a dog with TWO DJD elbows, but do not have any
problem breeding to a dog who has ONE DJD I elbow. I own a dog who has one
grade II elbow- but he also has a reason- he was attacked as a pup in my own
front yard by a neighbor's dog (claimed stray when I went knocking) who grabbed
my boy at 4 months old and fractured his skull, punctured his sinus, and broke
his arm in 4 places, including 2 breaks in his elbow. The dumbass broke his
cast one day trying to play with the other dogs and the break didn't set well
in the elbow/arm. Otherwise, I would NEVER use a Grade II "anything" elbow,
without a very good reason and proof to back that reason up. I have found
through my (and others') research that those dogs with Grade II elbow/s DO pass
bad elbows on in higher numbers than those with Grade I elbows (again of any
reason for the grading).
I say, one Grade I DJD elbow? So long as the family Hx is good, I would
Definitely use the dog for breeding; then breed the progeny accordingly- to
clean elbows only... Just in case it is a genetic reason that the parent dog
failed in the first place.
We have 20 years of elbow history to be able to use in our breeding program
decisions; one dog with one bad elbow is not reason enough for me to throw the
dog out!
Jen P & her Pack
On Wed, Jul 29, 2015 at 10:44 PM, Channing Sheets <cashe90@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
It would depend on the cause. Is it immune mediated problem? Is it a
traumatic injury? If it was a traumatic injury or because it was tapped for
some reason and there was scar tissue. Absolutely I would still use them. If
it was a process or immune mediated issue no. Find out the cause of the DJD.
Channing
From: dmarc-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2015 23:31:00 -0400
Subject: [ SHOWGSD-L ] DJD
To: showgsd-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
If you had a dog that did not have ununited anconeal or coronoid process but
ofa said DJD would you still use the dog for breeding? I say no the other
breeder says yes.
--
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Shepherds/Proud K911
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