Re: Neural Networks, Programming Languages

  • From: "Octavian Rasnita" <orasnita@xxxxxxxxx>
  • To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 09:09:53 +0300

For those who never seen a lisp program, please tell us what is good lisp for.

For creating Windows destop programs? For creating web apps? For something else?

Thanks.

Octavian

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "black ares" <matematicianu2003@xxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, October 16, 2008 12:59 AM
Subject: Re: Neural Networks, Programming Languages


> please, look at some examples in lisp.
> More than that I recomand you to see some web semantic examples in lisp.
> This is the best language to suport the learning feature.
> and this learning feature is one of the most important in A.I.
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Ricks Place" <OFBGMail@xxxxxxxxx>
> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 11:52 PM
> Subject: Re: Neural Networks, Programming Languages
> 
> 
>> Thanks Guys:
>> First, This project sounds like an extreme challange but  you guys and Old 
>> WillPearson use to talk about this stuff while I was still trying to learn 
>> what a class, method and property were.So thanks for putting up with what 
>> must seem to be really basic questions in an area I am not likely 
>> qualified to even scratch the surface of.I get Perceptrons. The math 
>> surrounding the more complex applications sounds daunting including Matrix 
>> Algebra upto Chaos Theory etc ( I can't remember how to spell Gausian and 
>> even the names of a couple of other mathfields mentioned ).
>> I made it through the Calc series but any math beyond there I would have 
>> to learn from e-books, or articles, and I'm not sure how possible that 
>> would be.
>> The Perceptron articles I read used figures, pictures, for many examples 
>> and formulas and they did not have any examples for beginning programmers 
>> to code up.
>> So, LISP is the way to go eh? Do you remember any good primers on building 
>> very beginner orientated AI Neural Network applications with programming 
>> examples to try out in any language?
>> Simple single layer forward only, oh darn, you know the right words...
>> Note, I do not mind buying a e-book if it's accessible.
>> I will research LISP on Google, do you have a favorite flavor, compiler or 
>> whatever development environment you use?
>> I am still trying to figure out if I can learn  enough AI to create a 
>> Neural Network tuned to do some Stock Market Analysis to augment my own 
>> Fundemental Analysis techniques.
>> Rick USA
>> Rick USA
>> From: "Sina Bahram" <sbahram@xxxxxxxxx>
>> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 3:51 PM
>> Subject: RE: Neural Networks, Programming Languages
>>
>>
>>> Please email me off list:
>>>
>>> sbahram@xxxxxxxxx
>>>
>>> Take care,
>>> Sina
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of black ares
>>> Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 3:28 PM
>>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Subject: Re: Neural Networks, Programming Languages
>>>
>>> I am interested in evry kind of documentationon lisp so if you can ofer
>>> something...
>>> More than the language it self, lisp ofer a variety of dialects (scheme) 
>>> or
>>> other like it.
>>> I remember that I don't know at all tcl/tk, but with my lisp knowledge I 
>>> was
>>>
>>> able to debug a program in tcl/tk.
>>> So if you have any good book on lisp and you are so kind to share it with
>>> me, i wait for it.
>>> I use lisp in my programming job.
>>> best regards
>>> Black Ares
>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>> From: "Sina Bahram" <sbahram@xxxxxxxxx>
>>> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 10:04 PM
>>> Subject: RE: Neural Networks, Programming Languages
>>>
>>>
>>>> To comment a little on this.
>>>>
>>>> Lisp is not a functional programming language. It supports a myriad of
>>>> programming styles which is why it has survived and thrived in some
>>>> instances for over 50 years.
>>>>
>>>> Lisp supports functional, procedural, logical, aspect oriented, and 
>>>> object
>>>> oriented styles just to name a very small few.
>>>>
>>>> Also, it is truly a wonderful language. In less than 300 lines of code, 
>>>> I
>>>> was able to write a distributed evolutionary algorithm to do the class 
>>>> of
>>>> traveling salesman like problems efficiently and quite nicely.
>>>>
>>>> As another example, the entire prolog language was implmented in lisp in
>>>> the
>>>> back of my introduction to lisp book, for example. Some of the three and
>>>> five liners in lisp are truly mind blowing.
>>>>
>>>> *chuckling*, and folks think I'm a java guy, *snicker*, man do I have 
>>>> them
>>>> fooled.
>>>>
>>>> I wish I had an opportunity to use lisp on a daily basis.
>>>>
>>>> Take care,
>>>> Sina
>>>>
>>>> ________________________________
>>>>
>>>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of black ares
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 2:56 PM
>>>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> Subject: Re: Neural Networks, Programming Languages
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> You can make A.I. even with visual c#, but you must make a lot of code.
>>>> There are other programming paradigms more dedicated to this.
>>>> 1. Functional programming (represented by lisp/scheme)
>>>> 2. Logical programming (represented by prolog)
>>>>
>>>> for example a gcd calculation in prolog will look like:
>>>> gcd(x,0,X).
>>>> gcd(X,Y,D):-R is X MOD Y,gcd(Y,R,D).
>>>>
>>>> Thats all
>>>> now you can make
>>>> gcd(15,5,X).
>>>> and in d you will have the result.
>>>>
>>>> Compare this with a traditional procedural/oop programming euclid
>>>> algorithm
>>>> and you will see the benefits.
>>>> For having A.I. is necessary to have the learning capability in your
>>>> software
>>>> that means that a method have to change is behavior from a calling to
>>>> another.
>>>> To be more explicit let say we have a method that receive 2 parameters
>>>> x and y to integers
>>>> at first call the method returns the sum of the two numbers.
>>>> Some where in time at another call the same method with same parameters
>>>> have
>>>> to return the product of the two integers.
>>>> that according to some lines which are between those two calls.
>>>> And this change in behavior must be not predictiv
>>>> so you can not do an if in the method and according to an conditon 
>>>> return
>>>> either the sum or the product.
>>>> For this situation functional programming respond better than other
>>>> paradigms.
>>>> Because in a functional programming language you can modify the body of 
>>>> a
>>>> function easy from call to call.
>>>> in c# in dotnet 2.0 this is posible only using reflection.
>>>> dotnet 3.0 introduced 2 new things that I like very much
>>>> 1. linq
>>>> 2. f#
>>>>
>>>> Also you can find on the net libraries written for c# used to interpret
>>>> lisp/prolog.
>>>> I worked with some of them in time to get faster results.
>>>>
>>>> best regards.
>>>> bBlack Ares
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> From: Ricks Place <mailto:OFBGMail@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> <mailto:programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 1:40 PM
>>>> Subject: Neural Networks, Programming Languages
>>>>
>>>> Hi Guys:
>>>> Just looking at overviews of how Neural Networks are used to predict
>>>> Stock Market movements. Is the AI done an any language like Vb.net or 
>>>> are
>>>> there specific Programming languages used here. I am just looking at the
>>>> possibilities to see if my programming and math knowledge would allow me
>>>> to
>>>> play with them some.
>>>> I have a good background in math, stats and Vb.net and can, of
>>>> course, learn other things if necessary but what might they be?
>>>> Rick USA
>>>>
>>>>
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