[lit-ideas] Re: Willie Pete
- From: Judy Evans <judithevans1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Wed, 9 Nov 2005 18:04:51 +0000
Wednesday, November 9, 2005, 5:26:56 PM, Eric Yost wrote:
EY> Judy: 1. we all know about Saddam, it should not be necessary
EY> for posters here concerned about current violence in Iraq to add
EY> a disclaimer to every post saying they are aware of Saddam's mass
EY> murders.
EY> 2. and that has been said before here...
EY> 3. your reply to Andy is cheap
EY> Eric: On the contrary, it should be necessary to consider the
EY> entire context of the current violence in Iraq, and that includes
EY> the oppression from which the Iraqis have been freed, and the
EY> oppression from which they seek to free themselves in future.
EY> (And yes, that includes the occupation but is by no means limited
EY> to it.)
I'm not saying that shouldn't be in our minds as we assess the
situation, I am saying it should not be necessary for people like me
(opponents of the War On Iraq) to
JE>add
JE> a disclaimer to every post saying they are aware of Saddam's mass
JE> murders.
there is a difference.
EY> Remember for example that this thread concerns febrile
EY> handwringing about ALLEGED use of white phosphorus smoke devices,
EY> ALLEGED use of napalm-like substance against military targets,
EY> and utterly fantastic claims of the use of poison gas.
I am aware of that.
EY> We all pity Iraqi noncombatants caught in the crossfire,
EY> disfigured, burned, killed, wounded, and otherwise damaged.
yes
EY> But
EY> what is the context? They were slaughtered under Saddam.
I think you mean other Iraqis (many) were slaughtered under Saddam.
EY> They
EY> were slaughtered by their local militia leaders.
I think you mean other Iraqis (etc.)
EY> They were tried
EY> and slaughtered by al-Qaeda mobsters
see above
EY> (was glad to read we bombed
EY> the hell out of one of their jury-rigged courtrooms). Then a
EY> small number were accidentally killed in ongoing combat, as
EY> almost always happens in warfare. And from all this carnage to
EY> single out US troops for vilification and outrage is as myopic as
EY> it is hypocritical.
Insofar as the US is singled out (I agree that to single out US troops
can be a bit mean but NB, "only following orders" is not normally
considered a defence) it is because the US is supposed to be better
*and says it is better*. Yet when someone critises US behaviour they
get called (e.g.) supporters of Stalin or told they ignore Stalin's
murders etc.. (Saddam has replaced Stalin, yes.)
(I am happy to add "when someone criticises UK behaviour...".)
EY> Finally, you call my reply to Andy cheap, when Andy has accused
EY> the US of genocide. Read his post. Or maybe you support his
EY> genocide thesis?
Your reply is cheap in that it accuses Andy (in effect) of not caring
about Iraqis killed by Saddam or by insurgents.
I am not endorsing all the material in all the "left" posts
in this thread; I have not been able to read them. I've been moving
e-addresses and run into trouble while doing so and have been trying
to check the facts in this case. I do stand my point: if I commit a
murder, the police here will take no note of a plea that someone else
committed 10 or even 300. (If I have a plea in mitigation that
concerns my situation and the circumstances, they may well treat me
with sympathy, and a court may too: a woman here who murdered her badly
disabled but not terminally ill son was -- in effect -- set free.)
--
Judy Evans, Cardiff, UK
mailto:judithevans1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
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