LH>No, I haven't changed my mind in regard to what I originally LH>said. I used the term "root cause" in the sense that I assumed LH>Mike Geary to be using it. Mike's use of "root causes" was clear to me. Your misunderstanding of him relates not to the meaning of "root causes" but to what he considers the root causes to be. He didn't say, of course; you assumed that by "causes" he meant "cause" and that he thought the cause -- well actually, it's a bit difficult to work out what you thought he thought the cause was, so I'll quote you LH>let's look at how Mike intended the term "root cause." LH> He didn't specify, but I took him to be using the old LH>Leftist idea that Capitalism causes proletarian revolutions, LH> and the "so-called" Islamist unrest is at root just such an one. LH>The U.S. was out in the world plying its greedy Capitalistic LH>trade and on 9/11, the chickens came home to roost. and you assumed this because Mike is on the left and people you'd call Leftists have -- you think -- said something like this. Let me, as someone who once called herself a Marxist and who studied Marxism at university and followed (that is, observed) trends on the Left pretty closely, object on behalf of the Left to your cartoon-like comments 1. It is not and never was as simple as "Capitalism causes proletarian revolutions" 2. Marxists had analysed nationalist and other non- proletarian movements for some decades by the time of the rise of Islamic fundamentalism 3. Yes there are some Marxist-Leninists who want to see class as the main motive force 4. And yes there remain some Marxists who see the economy as determinant "in the last instance" (note: I've checked Barnett out; he does seem to be rather like them in that). 5. But not all of these, by any means, said of 9/11 anything like "the chickens have come home to roost". LH> Although you can see from the MG note I just LH>responded to that he denies that I correctly understood LH> his vague term -- sort of. No, I don't Judy ----- Original Message ----- From: Lawrence Helm To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 9:21 PM Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: Five Years Ago No, I haven't changed my mind in regard to what I originally said. I used the term "root cause" in the sense that I assumed Mike Geary to be using it. Although you can see from the MG note I just responded to that he denies that I correctly understood his vague term -- sort of. Lawrence