[ SHOWGSD-L ] Re: Justifying the all breed
- From: Gsdman2@xxxxxxx
- To: showgsd-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Wed, 14 Dec 2005 00:32:46 EST
In a message dated 12/13/2005 9:12:12 PM Central Standard Time,
edwinx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx writes:
will try to answer that.....but I think Fred already did.....most dog shows
are all breed shows, therefore most judges that do Shepherds at these shows are
not Shepherd judges, therefore they do not have the same study and
understanding of the breed as a typical specialty judge
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Then again, most specialty judges do not have the same study and
understanding of the breed that Fred does. In that way, it's all relative.
Here are some facts ... I had a dog that did particularly well under Fred.
In fact, from the time the dog was seven months old he was shown to Fred five
times. In the first show he was Best Puppy, and Fred told me that he came very
close to giving him the five points ... and he "never points puppies." In the
second show he was WD for a specialty major (one of four major specialty
wins, not counting the futurity win and the maturity class win). In the third
show
under Fred he was Best of Breed. In the fourth show he was Canadian Select.
In the fifth show ... well ... he made all of the cuts until the fog rolled
in <lol>. Fred liked the dog and I don't think he would ever deny it. That
same dog was specialed six times in the all breeds. This was years ago so I
guess its not a problem to name names... In the first all breed weekend, the
breed judges were GSD people, Ann Gray and Lee Brown. The group judges were
Lee
Brown the first day and I don't remember the all breed judge's name the second
day. We opened the catalog to learn that Jimmy was there with his current top
GSD, and Yes Virginia was there fresh off of her win at the garden. There
were also a couple more specials, one of them a local dog that had group wins
and
placings. What the heck ... we threw the dice and showed the dog. We all
know that Moses parted the Red Sea, but on that day Moses had waved his hand
and
caused two good size outdoor rings to be combined ... which I was happy to
see. We took the breed win both days, and went Group three and four that
weekend. In the next two shows we went north, again under GSD judges at all
breeds.
The first day we lost to a class dog that wasn't my cup of tea at all (note
... the breed judge was a well known GSD person). The second day we lost breed
to Jimmy and the same special he had in our first meeting. The next two all
breeds were in Kentucky. The first day our dog did not perform .â?¦ Peg and I
weren't there and he had the ladies on his mind. The second day we won the
breed, Group One, and gave some little dog one heck of a run for Best in Show.
All of the judges that weekend were all breed judges.
I doubt that Fred was trying to imply that every all breed judges is bad, or
that all dogs shown in the all breeds are poor quality. In fact, I know Fran
and her dog, which happens to be a son to the one discussed above. He has
qualities that I'm sure Fred would appreciate ... probably the same qualities
that have impressed several all breed judges and gotten the dog close to his
championship. The truth is, I don't think I would lump every all breed judge
and
every specialty judge into two separate groups, one bad and one good. I've
seen some decent judging in both rings, and some pretty awful judging in both
rings. Neither would I agree with the argument that all breed judges are more
likely to put up name handlers. In my opinion, that is a problem in both
venues.
I do think Fred is right in that specialty judges, having bred and lived with
this particular breed, automatically have an advantage as a group. However,
breeding and raising this breed certainly does not make a person an expert at
judging it. At the same time, having an eye for judging dogs is something
special in itself, in my opinion. That gift is not exclusive to any person in
any
breed, and that eye can easily cross over to other breeds for some people.
I am not the breeder, but I had also suggested to Fran that her dog would do
best in the all breeds. I didn't make that judgment because of some failing
the dog had. By the time I first saw him with Fran, he was already moving slow
and easy, very controlled, next to his handler. I've done this for a lot of
years and I've come to the conclusion that specialty dogs need to be raised to
show in the specialty ring if they will be successful. I doubt many of you
will deny that? No ... that does not mean 100 mph on a tight lead. However,
they absolutely have to learn to go out on the lead, and to do it well with a
look at me attitude, that is something that needs to be encouraged from day
one. We never won a class at a specialty until we figured that out years ago.
I'm apparently writing a book here and I know Fred will have stopped reading
it by now lol ... but I haven't been posting much so what the heck...
The number one problem with the all breeds is ring size and footing. Even if
a judge doesn't understand GSD movement, it only takes one really good moving
GSD in a good size ring to impress them with the basics of a ground covering
balanced gait. I once attended an all breed with the usual hard floor postage
size ring. Somehow, seven specials were entered at that show. I carefully
watched the breed judging, decided I wouldn't even own any one of those seven
GSD champions, much less show them, and at that point Peg and I began our move
to the specialty ring. I don't for a moment think it was a coincidence that
seven really poor examples of a GSD champion had converged on that one tiny
slippery ring in an attempt to get a breed win. That environment is how they
managed to finish and it was the only place they could possibly win. Yes, we
went back and showed our specialty winning dog at the all breeds, but only at
shows that we knew would have large grassy rings. We made no attempt to hold
the
dog back while he was showing off his gait, except to maintain the loose lead
which I always begged his handlers for. He looked bad on a tight lead ...
good moving dogs usually do. Not only did the judges show their appreciation
for
the dog's motion, but ringside ... I'm talking Chihuahua people, Cocker
Spaniel people, you name the breed ... went nuts over what they were seeing.
One
of them came up to me and said they "had never seen a GSD move like that." I
should mention that although this dog was a good sidegaiter, he wasn't the
greatest mover that ever lived. He covered a good amount of ground and he was
clean, powerful and balanced, as all GSDs should be. There was very little
exciting about the dog except for a noticeable lack of obvious faults. To some
specialists these days, that might spell mediocre ... Imagine that ... a dog
that
is hard to fault could be considered mediocre? I'm going to stop typing now
... I'm about to type myself into a whole other thread.
Tom Langlitz
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