[opendtv] Re: (No Date: Tue, 28 Sep 2004 10:30:37 -0400

  • From: "nat ostroff" <nostroff@xxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: <opendtv@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Thu, 14 Oct 2004 21:16:41 -0400

I am reading this thread and cannot believe that the readers have forgotten
the bitter fight that I and others put up to get the option to have a COFDM
alternative placed in the ATSC standard. After several years of fighting
intentional misinformation and political manipulation of technical data we
lost that battle. Unfortunately the song lyric that says "you don't know
what you got till it is gone" seems to apply to our current situation.

We do have Zenith to thank for sticking with their promise to make
significant improvements to 8VSB reception. For that we all should be
grateful. Unfortunately we don't have the advantage of a COFDM service with
all of its mobile and small antenna reception options but at least we have
something that might serve as a fixed indoor service for over the air DTV.
Of course the advantages of COFDM are going to be enjoyed by companies like
Qualcom who are building a COFDM based service on a nationwide basis using
the TV UHF frequency band. The present outcome is to their advantage and our
distress.

Nat Ostroff

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Barry Wilkins" <Barry.Wilkins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <opendtv@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, October 14, 2004 6:09 PM
Subject: [opendtv] Re: (No Date: Tue, 28 Sep 2004 10:30:37 -0400


> John,
>
> That is truly amazing! Thanks for the information.
>
> Barry Wilkins
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Willkie [mailto:johnwillkie@xxxxxxxxxx]=20
> Sent: Friday, 15 October 2004 10:29 a.m.
> To: opendtv@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [opendtv] Re: (No Date: Tue, 28 Sep 2004 10:30:37 -0400
>
> I hope I do not get in too much trouble for this, but to date, the
> evidence
> is thus:
>
> MIT (Dr. William Schreiber) was an advocate of a non-VSB form of
> modulation.
> Another professor at MIT had what he thought was a better way to
> transmit
> digital audio than AC-3.  Dolby (non-Korean IP holder with extensive
> licensing fees in the ATSC world) felt otherwise.
>
> Dolby was part of the Grand Alliance, and MIT had some intellectual
> property
> (as did and was Sarnoff, another non-Korean IP holder in the ATSC world)
> that the Grand Alliance wanted.  To cut to the chase, Dolby made a less
> than
> ethical deal with MIT that subverted the Schreiber and audio initiatives
> of
> MIT.  The other professor was promised 25% cut of a $10 million
> "payment"
> that Dolby was to make to MIT when ATSC became standard.
>
> Dolby -- true to form -- did not make the payment.  MIT sued a few years
> ago.  When Dolby lost a summary judgment motion to have the case
> dismissed,
> they ended up paying, and the professor got his money.  Yes, Dolby had
> to be
> sued to pay a promised commercial bribe.
>
> It ain't anything to be proud about, but I suspect that -- lacking the
> "fair
> and reasonable terms" that the FCC imposed on everything -- the DVB
> world
> could be as bad or worse.
>
> Upshot: 8-VSB is the "greased skid" transitional standard in the U.S.,
> and
> if COFDM is that much cheaper for the same effect, then it will overtake
> 8-VSB in the U.S.
>
> As to overseas, that ship sailed in 1988, when LG gained effective
> control
> of Zenith, the entity that everybody was trying to keep American.  If
> South
> Korea keeps up on it's current course, Kim Il Sung will be controlling
> the
> IP.
>
> Then, there's the matter of the E-VSB and E-AC-3 IP ...
>
> John Willkie
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: opendtv-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:opendtv-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Barry Wilkins
> Sent: Thursday, October 14, 2004 1:09 PM
> To: opendtv@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [opendtv] Re: (No Date: Tue, 28 Sep 2004 10:30:37 -0400
>
>
> John, Frank,
>
> I cannot help but think though, that because (a large portion of or
> all?) the patent revenues may go to Korea, AND there have been
> performance difficulties AND the relative cost of silicon to build an
> ATSC receiver that performs well is expensive, then it looks like a 3
> way loss situation. This is ironic as I understand that the US
> originated COFDM modulation. Why wasn't there an effort to ditch the
> ATSC modulation at the earliest opportunity if (a) the revenue was
> likely to go overseas, and (b) there were strong indications of
> performance limitations and (c) there was an opportunity to use a US
> version of COFDM that you could get patent royalties from?
> Barry Wilkins
>
>
>
> >And, what's really at play in the modulation wars -- even going back to
> the
> >1920's -- is patents, IP and licensing.   I know I'm not the only
> person on
> >this list who knows this, but I'm the only one who talks publicly about
> >THAT.
>
> You are absolutely correct, and you are the only one on this list who
> has talked publicly about THAT. The IP licensing cost of an ATSC
> receiver/decoder will soon exceed the silicon + software cost, and a
> chunk of that will go to LGE for the 8-VSB patents. We have discussed
> this on OpenDTV many times in the past, including some news articles
> that put a dollar figure on the IP windfall that LGE expects from the
> ATSC tuner mandate.
>
>
>
> Barry Wilkins
> Hardware Design Engineer
> Xtendreach
> 12 Wakefield St
> Napier
> New Zealand
> E-mail:barry.wilkins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Ph:64 6 831 0214
>
>
>
>
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> =20
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