[ SHOWGSD-L ] Re: Rights and Wrong and in between
- From: "Carolyn Martello" <marhaven@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <ducksavsfan@xxxxxxxxx>, <showgsd-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2013 23:36:21 -0700
I can get "defensive" because I get very tired of the assumption that
we who show....ONLY care about the looks of a dog and we all inbreed our
dogs into an unhealthy corner!! I get tired of being put in that box
because we breed "show dogs".
We care very much about VERY sound healthy and intelligent dogs. We
also care very much that a GSD is a great GSD to look at..and we love to
see a good one move around athletically with power and strength and that
easy ground covering gait.
We will definitely inbreed occasionally and line breed a lot. That does not
mean we do it with no thought and no concern for happy healthy puppies!
When we decide on a line breeding or close breeding we are not burying our
heads in sand..though I do like to sit on a sandy beach....<G>
ALSO....
*. WE have gotten more problems from outcrossing than line breeding.
*. Line breeding OR inbreeding does NOT cause 'problem' genes to develop.
IF you are inbreeding and the problem is not there..inbreeding cannot
CAUSE the problem! You won't 'create' a problem with an inbreeding.
The problem has to already be there.
*. You can do a total outcross breeding and still both parents can carry
the problem gene coming down from different lines or dogs.
The gene is STILL THERE.
*. You can look at a pedigree..know there is a problem on one side because
of
a particular dog...breed to an outcross because THAT dog or line is not
there
and STILL get the problem through ANOTHER dog in the outcross pedigree
that
carries the same problem. ONE dog or ONE line is never the only
carrier!!
You are only fooling yourself to think an outcross will solve it. It
often
just means "YOU don't know about it".....<G>
*. ALL lines carry problems. You can look at a pedigree and see a specific
problem known to be carried by one of the relatives...it does NOT mean
your
Dam or Sire IS a CARRIER. You DO need to find that out if you are going
to
use them for breeding.
*. Please don't tell me that ONLY outcross litters are the only healthy
pups
going into homes or being used for breeding.
carolyn marhaven@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
www.marhaven.com
*************************************************
-----Original Message-----
On Behalf Of Christina Klahn
Another interesting question. How many out there have x-rayed hips after
the initial OFAs at 2? I know several who have and the hips show
deterioration as the dogs ages.  The author doesn't say bad hips, he says
osteoarthritis. That's not the same in my book as hip displasia or "bad
hips". Also, I will stand on this one that he has a point on the amount of
inbreeding in some breeds (including our own) that can only cause issues
down the road because of the cut down gene pool People complain about
"throwing the baby out with the bath water" because they tested or produced
"x" disease because it cuts down the gene pool. Isn't inbreeding, line
breeding and heavily breeding on the popular sire of the day doing the same
thing, especially when the popular sire of the day is related to the past
sire of the day and then some? Yes, you can show your issues very quickly
doing a inbred or line bred litter, but is it worth it to send these dogs
out
to the unsuspecting public that owns 80% if not more are in pet homes?Â
This book has also opened my eyes to many things, one of them is the
serious dangers inherent in only breeding for looks as opposed to the whole
package. Some people need to pull their heads out of the sand and stop
being defensive and start breeding for the complete GSD. Isn't that why we
love this breed? I guarantee that most people won't only point to looks as
to why they love GSDs. Just my two cents.
Tina KlahnÂ
Illusion GSDs
ducksavsfan@xxxxxxxxx
************************************************************
From: Fran Henry <fhenry1@xxxxxxxxxxx>
I really like the book, but I agree with Evan that his take on GSDs is at
best, uninformed, and at worst, ignorant. Please do look him up, Candy, and
educate him re GSDs. <G>
Fran Henry
*****************************************************************
On Jun 27, 2013, at 8:41 AM, " John Zumwalt" <candiasgsd@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
> I just ordered the book yesterday for my Kindle Fire and started it today.
I was shocked
to find out that he's a local guy. I work in Jackson Hole and get to the
see the Tetons
on my way to work each day. I may have to look him up to discuss our
breed!
> CandyZ> www.candiasgsd.com Website updated 11-18-12
****************************************************************************
********
> scenecrest.geo@xxxxxxxxx writes:It is a great book and I had the
pleasure of
meeting Ted Kerasote,>> I found >Â him very knowable on what he writes.
**********************************************************
>>What did you think about his theory about angulation being the sign of bad
hips. And, most German Shepherd have bad hips.>>
Evan L. Ginsburg
*******************************************************
> Did not read any theory he had about angulation and sign of bad hips.
> However, some German Shepherd breeders and Data
> from the Hip Improvement Program at the University of Pennsylvania's
School of Veterinary Medicine supports these critiques: modern> German
Shepherds have a 60 oercent chance of having osteoarthritis in their hips
once they pass the age of two"
> Theresa
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