[lit-ideas] Re: "Stand By Denmark" Rally
- From: JimKandJulieB@xxxxxxx
- To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Sat, 25 Feb 2006 11:16:15 EST
Great. Now we have New Islamisists and Old Islamisists.
Does anyone have a cheat sheet or a score card?
Julie Krueger
========Original Message======== Subj: [lit-ideas] Re: "Stand By
Denmark" Rally Date: 2/25/06 10:07:14 A.M. Central Standard Time From:
_lawrencehelm@xxxxxxxxxxxxx (mailto:lawrencehelm@xxxxxxxxxxxx) To:
_lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx (mailto:lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx) Sent on:
I think it is up to the Moderate Islamists to distinguish themselves from
the Fundamentalists, not those of us who read their writings. After reading
Islam without Fear, Egypt and the New Islamists by Raymond William Baker, I
didnât see as much of a distinction between the New and Old Islamists as
Baker
thought existed. Bakerâs Egyptian Islamists were still fundamentalist but
more nuanced in their theology. The New Islamists wouldnât support
terrorism
or terrorist organizations but they agreed with much of the very restrictive
hallmarks of the Islamism we have grown accustomed to hearing about.
Also the New Islamists are pretty much keeping their mouths shut. If you do
find one speaking up you can be pretty sure heâs either agreeing with the
old Islamists or writing from some place in Europe or America. Do any of
these
New Islamists have any influence? Baker thinks the ones in Egypt may one
day have, but they are so reticent, so careful that no one knows for sure what
they think. They remind me of Heidegger writing in Nazi Germany. Did he
write so obscurely because he was by nature obscure, or did he do so to keep
the
Nazis from figuring out what he believed? On one of the issues where the
Egyptian new Islamists could have emphasized their difference by defending
Mahfouz, they failed, at least the most outspoken, Ghazzaly, did. He thought
Mahfouz should be censured for his writings.
I am not convinced that Turkey contains âmoderate Islam.â Ataturk set
Turkey up as a secular state. Islamists (Old Islamists) have tried to take
control but have been prevented from doing so by the Military. But even much
of
the military has been tainted with Islamism. There was a move to institute
Sharia Law in Turkey not so very long ago which would have been in direct
violation of their constitution.
Iâve spent some time looking for these âsafeâ Muslims youâve
mentioned. I
suspect they are in hiding.
Lawrence
-----Original Message-----
From: lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Omar Kusturica
Sent: Saturday, February 25, 2006 4:57 AM
To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: "Stand By Denmark" Rally
From: JimKandJulieB@xxxxxxx
To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Date: Sat, 25 Feb 2006 04:11:13 EST
<<Eric, you've told us how important it is to fight
Islam. >>
I don't think it is the notion of anyone (on this
list, at least), that the
West needs to fight Islam -- anymore than we need to
fight Judaism or
Christianity or ...fill in the blank.
*Oh, I wouldn't be too sure. Yes the talk is usually
about Islamism but there is very little attempt to
distinguish between radical Islamism, moderate
Islamism (governments of Turkey, Malaysia, Egypt etc.
all claim to be in Islamic in one way or other),
liberal Islamism, or even just traditional Islam. It
seems that the only way Muslims could be completely
safe from being perceived as enemies would be to
convert to Christianity.
In practice, of course, not all Muslims get treated as
enemies, or even all Islamists. But the decisions seem
to motivated by political interests of the moment
rather than by any intellectual or ethical criteria.
O.K.
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