[geocentrism] Re: Is geocentrism supported by facts? (Supplementary)
- From: Paul Deema <paul_deema@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 12:55:58 +0000 (GMT)
Neville J
Comments in this colour.
Paul D
----- Original Message ----
From: Neville Jones <njones@xxxxxxxxx>
To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Thursday, 1 November, 2007 4:01:00 PM
Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Is geocentrism supported by facts? (Supplementary)
Paul,
My replies in red:
www.GeocentricUniverse.com
-----Original Message-----
From: paul_deema@xxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 04:02:42 +0000 (GMT)
Neville J
Well we seem to have some common ground now. Are you reading this Allen?
Polaris, when considering the rotation about the ecliptic axis, is just another
star. The path to Polaris will define a cone of 47 degrees centred on the
ecliptic axis.
Yes, we are agreed on this, but Allen and I will not agree to what you maintain
next.
Now to the celestial coordinate system -- yes it works well but of course it is
only an artifact. And I'll stop you there, because it would not be a worthwhile
artifact if it did not work well. At no time have I suggested that it is not
worthwhile. If it did not work, then the chances are that you and I would never
have heard of it. The point is that whether it existed or not would make no
difference to star trails -- geo polar or ecliptic polar.
The rest of your post talks of latitude and longitude, for instance, but the
point that is escaping you is that latitude and longitude are fixed to the
thing whose coordinates they are describing. If they were not fixed, then they
would not work as they do.
To illustrate. Say we established latitude and longitude lines on the World
just as they have been defined, but at some particular instant. Say, then, that
the World started rotating relative to this grid of lines. Would the coordinate
system still work? No, it would not. If you knew the rate of rotation and the
direction, then you could always compensate for the movement, but no one needs
to do that, because latitude and longitude is fixed to the World. It is in
exactly the same way that right ascension and declination are fixed to the
celestial sphere. Both rotate about only the celestial polar axis. Well I think
that before this is over you see arguments which will convince any reasonable
man that that is not so. If the universe were seen to rotate about another axis
then the grid would no longer work as it does. This argument is entirely
specious.
Neville.
It is just an agreed set of markers which make it possible for one man to be
understood by another man when he describes where to look to see a comet etc.
It may well be the best system possible for man discussing day to day events
but even in this time frame, there are many other ways this could have been
achieved. As a child, I pondered latitude and longitude, and wondered why
longitude was not similar to latitude in consisting of a succession of rings on
parallel planes. It would have worked, but later I realised that there were
advantages to having longitude composed of circles which intersected on a
common line -- the axis of rotation.
Bottom line here is that systems devised by man for man revolve around the time
frame or some other consideration in which they will have the greatest utility.
If the time frame of greatest utility were to have an annual frequency rather
than daily, then a system based on the ecliptic pole could well be more
efficient. Horses for courses! And of course there is no reason why both should
not exist simultaneously, the system used for a given task being the one in
which calculations are more easily carried out. Inter planetary navigation I
feel sure would be much more likely to use a system based on the ecliptic as
this allows the location of the home world to be defined with only two
parameters rather than the three and the location of other planets vary only
slightly from the earth referenced ecliptic plan. I noticed in a post from
Philip M -- isn't he a terrier in the research arena? -- a reference to an
ecliptic which was based on the momentum of all
the planets in the solar system. I can see where this would have utility. And
of course that would be entirely an artifact, but still potentially just as
useful as any other reference system, and complete with its very own set of
ecliptic poles!
Paul D.
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