[access-uk] Re: georgie trial now available, initial opinion

  • From: Saqib Hussain <saqibh23@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  • Date: Fri, 3 Aug 2012 11:41:39 +0100

Georgie is not very responsive on my handset as light or heavy tapping
will not open up some of the items. Can anyone else comment about
their experience and state which phone they are using?

On 03/08/2012, Saqib Hussain <saqibh23@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> Hi. I don't like talking to my phone in public either. I don't mind
> dictating a message when I'm on my own but hate the idea of doing it
> in front of family and friend or even onn a bus. Bluetooth keyboards
> are ok if you want to compose a lengthy e-mail but since Fleksi has
> burst on to the market! I don't require a Bluetooth keyboard either.
> I've always thought that it sort of defeats the object of using a
> touch screen phone when you use a Bluetooth Keyboard for text
> messages.
>
> On 03/08/2012, Iain Lackie <ilackie@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> You will recall I'm sure the Guide Cats series of fundraising CDs from
>> BCAB.
>>
>> As the apps are named after a guide dog, BCAB should produce a Guide Cat
>> version.
>>
>>
>>
>> Iain
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Eleanor Burke
>> Sent: Friday, August 03, 2012 10:30 AM
>> To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: [access-uk] Re: georgie trial now available, initial opinion
>>
>> What is a guide cat version?
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Chris Moore" <moore.c@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> Sent: Friday, August 03, 2012 9:21 AM
>> Subject: [access-uk] Re: georgie trial now available, initial opinion
>>
>>
>>>I wonder if BCAB are working on a guide cat version :p
>>> On 3 Aug 2012, at 09:17, Jackie Cairns
>>> <jackie.cairnsplace@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Yeah but who cares?  Why have a flaming dog barking at all?  Do we come
>>>> across as that pathetic or what?  Sorry but this kind of patronising
>>>> stuff
>>>> really gets my goat! (smile).
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Kind Regards,
>>>>
>>>> Jackie Cairns
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
>>>> Behalf
>>>>
>>>> Of
>>>> Steve Nutt
>>>> Sent: 02 August 2012 14:54
>>>> To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> Subject: [access-uk] Re: georgie trial now available, initial opinion
>>>>
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>>> It's because Georgie is named after Margaret, Roger Wilson-Hind's
>>>> wife's
>>>> first guide dog.
>>>>
>>>> All the best
>>>>
>>>> Steve
>>>> --
>>>> Computer Room Services
>>>> 77 Exeter Close
>>>> Stevenage
>>>> Hertfordshire
>>>> SG1 4PW
>>>> Tel:  01438-742286
>>>> Mob: 07956334938
>>>> Fax: 01438-759589
>>>> Email: steve@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> Web: http://www.comproom.co.uk
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
>>>> Behalf
>>>>
>>>> Of
>>>> Eleanor Burke
>>>> Sent: 02 August 2012 13:05
>>>> To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> Subject: [access-uk] Re: georgie trial now available, initial opinion
>>>>
>>>> I wouldn't mind but my guide dogs, currently Neela, does not bark
>>>> *smile*
>>>>
>>>> so
>>>>
>>>> why the barking?
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Jackie Cairns" <jackie.cairnsplace@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> Sent: Thursday, August 02, 2012 11:17 AM
>>>> Subject: [access-uk] Re: georgie trial now available, initial opinion
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Hi Mo
>>>>>
>>>>> I read your very interesting message on the BCAB list which Colin
>>>>> Howard
>>>>> posted, presumably on your behalf.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'll say here what I said there.  Personally I feel it is reinventing
>>>>> the
>>>>> wheel.  I think it is taking advantage of those who perhaps haven't
>>>>> had
>>>>> the
>>>>> opportunity to really try out Android or Apple to see whether they can
>>>>> really master those operating systems.  But, as you say, time will
>>>>> tell.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm afraid that the barking made me cringe.  Do we really have to have
>>>>> these
>>>>> stupid sounds incorporated into "blind" products?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Kind Regards,
>>>>>
>>>>> Jackie Cairns
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
>>>>> Behalf
>>>>> Of
>>>>> Mobeen Iqbal
>>>>> Sent: 02 August 2012 00:02
>>>>> To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> Subject: [access-uk] georgie trial now available, initial opinion
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi.
>>>>>
>>>>> The georgie developers have finally seen fit to provide a trial on the
>>>>> google play store, all be it a 14 day trial. I have included a link
>>>>> below,
>>>>> as well as my initial findings. The following is just my opinion and i
>>>>> do
>>>>> not intend to start a debate on list, but it would be interesting to
>>>>> see
>>>>> what others think.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=net.screenreader.Georgie&featu
>>>>> re=search_result
>>>>>
>>>>> Main app interface: the first criticism i have is the fact that all
>>>>> navigation has to be acomplished via a touch screen. Trying on a
>>>>> samsung
>>>>> galaxy pro, i could not click any of the controls via the keyboard
>>>>> even
>>>>> though they are recognised as buttons. I could also not dial a phone
>>>>> number
>>>>> via the keyboard, something i was very very surprised at!
>>>>> something so simple that's been around for years has been over looked?
>>>>> this is probably because you have to hover over each item on the
>>>>> screen
>>>>> with
>>>>> your finger. on to my next point. it took me a while to figure out
>>>>> that
>>>>> you
>>>>> have to hover over a certain icon for 2 seconds or more until a tone
>>>>> is
>>>>> heard, then lift your finger to activate it. being used to the double
>>>>> tap
>>>>> system normally used in android, this came as a little qwerk i
>>>>> could've
>>>>> done
>>>>> with out, though i can see the logic behind it i guess.
>>>>> The logic being cut out the need to tap the icon twice and risk
>>>>> hitting
>>>>> another icon while you're at it. Also, i would've liked the ability to
>>>>> turn
>>>>> off the dog barking sound when the app is launched, and every time you
>>>>> return to the home screen from outside the app. nothing against guide
>>>>> dogs,
>>>>> but it could be a bit of an embarrassment in public places!
>>>>> Also, my phone really started lagging, something its never done with
>>>>> other
>>>>> applications no matter how many i've had installed at any one time.
>>>>> while
>>>>> i'm writing this, the phone's completely crashed, i'll go on to the
>>>>> apps
>>>>> when it reboots.
>>>>>
>>>>> On to the apps:
>>>>>
>>>>> Now my battery's back in and the thing's booted, by default, you can
>>>>> try
>>>>> out all the apps in the trial. i liked the fact you can adjust screen
>>>>> contrast/colours, and also the simplicity of the interface. there
>>>>> needs
>>>>> to be more user input in to what can be configured/added for the
>>>>> price,
>>>>> i can see this being aimed at a minority market relating specifically
>>>>> to
>>>>> the elderly or motor impaired.
>>>>>
>>>>> I did not like the fact that the volume rocker is taken over by the
>>>>> software. there are meant to be 3 pages, each page containing the
>>>>> various apps in various catagories. The volume rocker, instead of
>>>>> allowing you to alter the volume of the app in realtime cycles through
>>>>> the various pages. it also appears to unlock the phone when its been
>>>>> locked, something which i wasn't too impressed with. on android, its
>>>>> standard practis that all buttons are locked and the power button plus
>>>>> jesture is used to unlock. page1 has your standard apps, messaging
>>>>> dialer etc, page 2 goes on to OCR, colour recognition etc, page 3 is
>>>>> thankfully nothing rood, its your lifestile apps containing twitter,
>>>>> audio book services, talking newspapers etc. I would've apreciated it
>>>>> if
>>>>> the developers had enabled scroling so you could scrole to page 2/3,
>>>>> or
>>>>> again provided a setting to switch between various modes for various
>>>>> functions i.e the ability to turn things on and off, or use
>>>>> alternative
>>>>> jestures for commands.
>>>>>
>>>>> I am going to be using the software over the next 2 weeks, so may post
>>>>> further findings. Also if people request, i may consider doing an
>>>>> audio
>>>>> demo all be it opinionated giving each app a chance, to save people
>>>>> installing it. I would also have liked to see tighter integration with
>>>>> google maps. At the moment, yes you can find out where your nearest
>>>>> bus
>>>>> stop is, taxi information, but you don't appear to be able to send
>>>>> these
>>>>> to google maps to navigate to the destination in mind.
>>>>>
>>>>> The voice applications also appear, or may rely on the internet. I
>>>>> haven't tested the application offline yet with no internet
>>>>> connection,
>>>>> but suspect that because of past experience, the phone will be sending
>>>>> what ever you say, dictated text messages, numbers, etc to google's
>>>>> servers then back to your phone. Any android user using this app may
>>>>> wish they were on some kind of data plan if this is the case.
>>>>>
>>>>> I have also tried the colour recogniser application. ironically, a
>>>>> freely available talking colour application from the android market,
>>>>> Colour ID,  produced better results than their app! Their app just
>>>>> stated my teashirt colour as black, the colour ID app was kind enough
>>>>> to
>>>>> be more specific and tell me that it was brownish black, and that the
>>>>> colour of my door was grey.
>>>>>
>>>>> The OCR app appeared to be doing something, though it requires the
>>>>> user
>>>>> to have the phone level, i.e as if resting flat on a desk before it'll
>>>>> scan. this could proove to be an issue if reading a sign/business
>>>>> information that isn't necessarily on a flat surface. oh dear, where's
>>>>> the gents? i'm getting desperate now!
>>>>>
>>>>> You can configure settings remotely for georgie via the web, or sight
>>>>> and sound can do this for you. i'm not comfortable with this approach.
>>>>> I'd like to know how secure the remote access app used is? is it
>>>>> encrypted? how safe is user data? Privacy is at risk, what if they can
>>>>> read your text messages? one user complained that sight and sound or
>>>>> someone sent him an unsolicited text message because he posted a bad
>>>>> review! this could be a error/over reaction or mistake  on his part,
>>>>> but? i've installed this on a handset i'm not bothered about but i'd
>>>>> be
>>>>> hesitant to install this on a handset i'm using for daily use.
>>>>>
>>>>> I would've liked to see inclusion of an email application, as well as
>>>>> a
>>>>> web browser of some kind. georgie at present won't support this at
>>>>> present so you'd have to use talkback to surf the web.
>>>>>
>>>>> I also couldn't find an option to access the rest of the phone's
>>>>> settings, though i haven't customised it or atempted to unlock
>>>>> advanced
>>>>> settings if any are available. apparently you can control what the
>>>>> user
>>>>> can do on the phone and provide/limit access to certain functions, so
>>>>> we'll see if in the next few days i unlock this supposed
>>>>> functionality.
>>>>> An option to access the android market or the app draw would've been
>>>>> nice, though again this doesn't appear to be their aim. their aim
>>>>> appears to be make the phone as simple as possible for a basic user,
>>>>> and
>>>>> that's it. for a hefty price tag! The app also froze, and i received a
>>>>> force close message on screen informing me that georgie had
>>>>> terminated.
>>>>> i then had to reactivate it via my home button. that, by the way was
>>>>> when i tried to access the georgie news option. this option is meant
>>>>> to
>>>>> provide you with the latest updates from the world of georgie, i have
>>>>> visions of them providing georgie with his own personal blog! there
>>>>> are
>>>>> after all pages on facebook for pets. nothing wrong with that of
>>>>> course... but? anyway back to the point.
>>>>>
>>>>> And now on to my final point. the contacts app, call/phone app,
>>>>> messaging app, colour recogniser app, and even the OCR app using
>>>>> google
>>>>> goggles all have free alternatives. Google maps are a lot better now
>>>>> and
>>>>> its becoming easier to find your location, to navigate to places, to
>>>>> find local places of interest, and its all free! even if you do
>>>>> pourchase mobile accessibility, at least you can use it outside its
>>>>> own
>>>>> homescreen if you wish! What would then prompt me to buy this. I would
>>>>> buy it if i had a really basic android user in mind, though i'd first
>>>>> try my very hardest to go the free/lower cost  root not because i'm
>>>>> stingy, but a lot of the time people don't have money to burn and also
>>>>> there are apps out there that do the job. the eyes free shell home
>>>>> screen is perfectly customisable and allows you to make things as
>>>>> simple
>>>>> as they could be for someone by adding/removing the apps the user has
>>>>> access to. Mobile accessibility is basic enough for most people. Also,
>>>>> if my client just wanted a basic phone, basic second hand and brand
>>>>> new
>>>>> nokia symbian phones abound on the internet. the haven phone could
>>>>> also
>>>>> be imported to the UK, and i saw a phone that spoke the numbers dialed
>>>>> for £15 in tesco the other day. The only reason i would personally
>>>>> spend
>>>>> any money on this application is the OCR capability, and possibly the
>>>>> audio book/talking newspaper ability though at that price, do we get a
>>>>> free subscription to the services in question? perhaps we should?
>>>>>
>>>>> the pricing model is also unclear. they state that £150 will get you
>>>>> the
>>>>> default apps. now as far as i know, that's just the basic apps,
>>>>> dialer,
>>>>> messaging, contacts, georgie news and help, the phone dialer, and the
>>>>> call log. mobile accessibility offers all this and more for almost a
>>>>> third of the price! yes MA isn't perfect but that's not the point, who
>>>>> is? £25 extra each for the lifestile and communications apps doesn't
>>>>> net
>>>>> you much. the audio books app, the camera app, again a free
>>>>> alternative
>>>>> available, OCR, tweet by voice, ask any question by voice anyone ever
>>>>> heard of freely available jeanie? talking newspapers, podcasts, and
>>>>> lets
>>>>> not forget the amazing voice blog. If anyone wants to hear me singing
>>>>> in
>>>>> the shower, please let me know! the potential is amazing isn't it? the
>>>>> sarcasm is partly intentional, sorry i'll stop it now...
>>>>>
>>>>> So, from this hotchpotch email, a conclusion: the app is very over
>>>>> priced, even code factory who i expected to charge a lot more for
>>>>> their
>>>>> app haven't charged much at all, its even available stripped down in
>>>>> the
>>>>> US for free. If users have free alternatives and are only paying for
>>>>> simplicity which can be achieved with selection of a few choice
>>>>> free/low
>>>>> paid apps, what will compell people to buy this? now if they'd
>>>>> included
>>>>> a turn by turn navigation aid like wayfinder for symbian if anyone
>>>>> remembers that, that would've impressed me. I really hope that the
>>>>> company does well, though there's still a long way to go. I hope it
>>>>> does
>>>>> not go the same way as thunder i.e get knocked out by an open source,
>>>>> free!  effort like NVDA. I never really managed to achieve much with
>>>>> the
>>>>> thunder screen reader, it was rather embarrassing when atempting to
>>>>> demo
>>>>> it as part of training a few years ago it kept crashing. we couldn't
>>>>> even get it to read out word documents or the web in a satisfactory
>>>>> manner.
>>>>>
>>>>> As i have already said the opinions i express above are just based on
>>>>> early findings. A lot could change over the next 2 weeks. I may end up
>>>>> loving? georgie, though i doubt i'll be paying for it. If i've been
>>>>> harsh on the developers, it wasn't intentional. the georgie app only
>>>>> has
>>>>> a 2.2 star rating on the play store, and the majority of the reviews
>>>>> are
>>>>> from those that are experiencing frustration using the application.
>>>>> some
>>>>> can't get it to work though this could be user error. i wonder how
>>>>> many
>>>>> phones they tested this on?
>>>>>
>>>>> From a business standpoint, if you set the right price people will buy
>>>>> your product, set it too high and they'll turn to other sollutions.
>>>>> £300
>>>>> with a handset included? a Nokia C5 with talks costs £100, a basic
>>>>> handset like the sony experia pro with icecream sandwitch which is
>>>>> totally accessible would only cost £180 at the most.
>>>>>
>>>>> finally, i'd like to round things off by quoting a comment from
>>>>> someone
>>>>> called justin on the eyes-free list with which i agree. i hope you
>>>>> don't
>>>>> mind me quoting you justin, though i don't know you personally.
>>>>>
>>>>> Justin <justinmacleod@xxxxxxxxxxx> Aug 01 10:06PM +0100
>>>>>
>>>>> That's what I think is so scandalous. They are indeed targeting older
>>>>> people
>>>>> and those who are less up to speed with computers, those who don't
>>>>> know
>>>>> better or those that can't, for whatever reason, cope with the free,
>>>>> cheeper
>>>>> alternative that actually does more. Why should they have to pay more
>>>>> for
>>>>> less?
>>>>>
>>>>> Anyway, it would be great to hear people's experiences. If i'm wrong
>>>>> about anything in this email, i'll gladly stand corrected and i'm
>>>>> still
>>>>> giving georgie a fair chance. People are also welcome to write to me
>>>>> off
>>>>> list,
>>>>>
>>>>> mobeeniqbal@xxxxxxxxx
>>>>>
>>>>> is where you'll find me. Its taken the best part of 2 hours to write
>>>>> this, anyone for a cup of tea?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks for reading,
>>>>>
>>>>> Mo.
>>>>>
>>>>> ** To leave the list, click on the immediately-following link:-
>>>>> ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=unsubscribe]
>>>>> ** If this link doesn't work then send a message to:
>>>>> ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> ** and in the Subject line type
>>>>> ** unsubscribe
>>>>> ** For other list commands such as vacation mode, click on the
>>>>> ** immediately-following link:-
>>>>> ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=faq]
>>>>> ** or send a message, to
>>>>> ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the Subject:- faq
>>>>>
>>>>> ** To leave the list, click on the immediately-following link:-
>>>>> ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=unsubscribe]
>>>>> ** If this link doesn't work then send a message to:
>>>>> ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> ** and in the Subject line type
>>>>> ** unsubscribe
>>>>> ** For other list commands such as vacation mode, click on the
>>>>> ** immediately-following link:-
>>>>> ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=faq]
>>>>> ** or send a message, to
>>>>> ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the Subject:- faq
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> I am using the free version of SPAMfighter.
>>>> SPAMfighter has removed 459 of my spam emails to date.
>>>> Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len
>>>>
>>>> Do you have a slow PC? Try Free scan
>>>> http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ** To leave the list, click on the immediately-following link:-
>>>> ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=unsubscribe]
>>>> ** If this link doesn't work then send a message to:
>>>> ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> ** and in the Subject line type
>>>> ** unsubscribe
>>>> ** For other list commands such as vacation mode, click on the
>>>> ** immediately-following link:-
>>>> ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=faq]
>>>> ** or send a message, to
>>>> ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the Subject:- faq
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ** To leave the list, click on the immediately-following link:-
>>>> ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=unsubscribe]
>>>> ** If this link doesn't work then send a message to:
>>>> ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> ** and in the Subject line type
>>>> ** unsubscribe
>>>> ** For other list commands such as vacation mode, click on the
>>>> ** immediately-following link:-
>>>> ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=faq]
>>>> ** or send a message, to
>>>> ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the Subject:- faq
>>>>
>>>> ** To leave the list, click on the immediately-following link:-
>>>> ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=unsubscribe]
>>>> ** If this link doesn't work then send a message to:
>>>> ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> ** and in the Subject line type
>>>> ** unsubscribe
>>>> ** For other list commands such as vacation mode, click on the
>>>> ** immediately-following link:-
>>>> ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=faq]
>>>> ** or send a message, to
>>>> ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the Subject:- faq
>>>>
>>>
>>> ** To leave the list, click on the immediately-following link:-
>>> ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=unsubscribe]
>>> ** If this link doesn't work then send a message to:
>>> ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> ** and in the Subject line type
>>> ** unsubscribe
>>> ** For other list commands such as vacation mode, click on the
>>> ** immediately-following link:-
>>> ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=faq]
>>> ** or send a message, to
>>> ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the Subject:- faq
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ** To leave the list, click on the immediately-following link:-
>> ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=unsubscribe]
>> ** If this link doesn't work then send a message to:
>> ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> ** and in the Subject line type
>> ** unsubscribe
>> ** For other list commands such as vacation mode, click on the
>> ** immediately-following link:-
>> ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=faq]
>> ** or send a message, to
>> ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the Subject:- faq
>>
>> ** To leave the list, click on the immediately-following link:-
>> ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=unsubscribe]
>> ** If this link doesn't work then send a message to:
>> ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> ** and in the Subject line type
>> ** unsubscribe
>> ** For other list commands such as vacation mode, click on the
>> ** immediately-following link:-
>> ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=faq]
>> ** or send a message, to
>> ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the Subject:- faq
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> MSN Saqib500@xxxxxxxxxxx
>


-- 
MSN Saqib500@xxxxxxxxxxx
** To leave the list, click on the immediately-following link:-
** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=unsubscribe]
** If this link doesn't work then send a message to:
** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
** and in the Subject line type
** unsubscribe
** For other list commands such as vacation mode, click on the
** immediately-following link:-
** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=faq]
** or send a message, to
** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the Subject:- faq

Other related posts:

  1. Home
  2. access-uk
  3. Archive
  4. 08-2012