[lit-ideas] Re: "Stand By Denmark" Rally
- From: "Lawrence Helm" <lawrencehelm@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Sat, 25 Feb 2006 08:06:54 -0800
I think it is up to the Moderate Islamists to distinguish themselves from
the Fundamentalists, not those of us who read their writings. After reading
Islam without Fear, Egypt and the New Islamists by Raymond William Baker, I
didn't see as much of a distinction between the New and Old Islamists as
Baker thought existed. Baker's Egyptian Islamists were still fundamentalist
but more nuanced in their theology. The New Islamists wouldn't support
terrorism or terrorist organizations but they agreed with much of the very
restrictive hallmarks of the Islamism we have grown accustomed to hearing
about.
Also the New Islamists are pretty much keeping their mouths shut. If you do
find one speaking up you can be pretty sure he's either agreeing with the
old Islamists or writing from some place in Europe or America. Do any of
these New Islamists have any influence? Baker thinks the ones in Egypt may
one day have, but they are so reticent, so careful that no one knows for
sure what they think. They remind me of Heidegger writing in Nazi Germany.
Did he write so obscurely because he was by nature obscure, or did he do so
to keep the Nazis from figuring out what he believed? On one of the issues
where the Egyptian new Islamists could have emphasized their difference by
defending Mahfouz, they failed, at least the most outspoken, Ghazzaly, did.
He thought Mahfouz should be censured for his writings.
I am not convinced that Turkey contains "moderate Islam.' Ataturk set
Turkey up as a secular state. Islamists (Old Islamists) have tried to take
control but have been prevented from doing so by the Military. But even
much of the military has been tainted with Islamism. There was a move to
institute Sharia Law in Turkey not so very long ago which would have been in
direct violation of their constitution.
I've spent some time looking for these "safe" Muslims you've mentioned. I
suspect they are in hiding.
Lawrence
-----Original Message-----
From: lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Omar Kusturica
Sent: Saturday, February 25, 2006 4:57 AM
To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: "Stand By Denmark" Rally
From: JimKandJulieB@xxxxxxx
To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Date: Sat, 25 Feb 2006 04:11:13 EST
<<Eric, you've told us how important it is to fight
Islam. >>
I don't think it is the notion of anyone (on this
list, at least), that the
West needs to fight Islam -- anymore than we need to
fight Judaism or
Christianity or ...fill in the blank.
*Oh, I wouldn't be too sure. Yes the talk is usually
about Islamism but there is very little attempt to
distinguish between radical Islamism, moderate
Islamism (governments of Turkey, Malaysia, Egypt etc.
all claim to be in Islamic in one way or other),
liberal Islamism, or even just traditional Islam. It
seems that the only way Muslims could be completely
safe from being perceived as enemies would be to
convert to Christianity.
In practice, of course, not all Muslims get treated as
enemies, or even all Islamists. But the decisions seem
to motivated by political interests of the moment
rather than by any intellectual or ethical criteria.
O.K.
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