[ SHOWGSD-L ] Re: was small National entry? / two "types"
- From: Terry Cochran <fairway97045@xxxxxxxxx>
- To: hckryhillgsd@xxxxxxxxxxxxx, "Doctrcorgi@xxxxxxx" <Doctrcorgi@xxxxxxx>
- Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2005 15:43:45 -0700 (PDT)
Who knows maybe it is a location thing. I know that we tend to see dogs in the
Northwest show in both rings because there are so few specialty show here.
There is quality dogs in the All breeds here because those are the shows to go
to to finish a dog.
Wonder what will happen if the Specialty clubs continue to fail?
When I think of a great All Breed dog I think of Mystic and Dallas
Terry
Steve Grainger <hckryhillgsd@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Terry..since we and I am sure others have finished dogs in both venues how
do you arrive at your conclusion?To date..I don't think I have shown a dog
to its championship that is unworthy of finishing in either venue.To me
mediocrity whether all-breed or Specialty is a travesty to the
breed...whether it be the specialty dog so extreme, it looks like a swamp
rabbit...or the to all-breed dog that looks like King with his ass end
higher than his whiter..it doesn't matter..both are wrong..you can say it
is the folks..you can say it is interpretation...I say it is a
justification..those who never show at specialties justify their position
by saying "specialty dogs are cripples ". However..they fail to see the
lack of proper shoulder, soft long backs...flat croups..long hocks and that
their dogs lack movement that makes our breed unique...those who show only
at Specialties justify their position by saying "Well these are specialty
dogs..they are supposed to be extreme." this group fails to see their dogs
are freaks of nature..walking on their hocks..dragging their toes and that
their dogs also lack movement unique for our breed and probably are unable
to participate in even the most remedial obedience, herding or agility
events. so to me Terry..it is not about "interpretation"..there is no room
for this type of interpretation on either side..to me both groups represent
stupidity about the essence of the breed. Christine Grainger
> [Original Message]
> From: Terry Cochran
> To: ; Doctrcorgi@xxxxxxx
> Cc:
> Date: 4/15/2005 3:53:06 PM
> Subject: [ SHOWGSD-L ] Re: was small National entry? / two "types"
>
> I think the biggest difference between the All Breed Ring and the
Specialty ring is the owners of the dogs
>
> Specialty folks consider Moderate to mean Mediocre
> All Breed folks consider Moderate to mean the Standard
>
> Plain and simple it is the way we each understand the breed standard as
written.
> Terry
> Steve Grainger wrote:
>
> .The other day I stated I felt that the specialty GSD was very difficult
to
> breed correctly. Someone asked me privately why I felt that
> way..the(unscientific) explantion(cliff notes version) was that we have
> movement that is very unique to this breed.yet we also have a desired type
> and temperament .many of.desirable traits in this breed are comprised
> predominately of recessive traits. if you look at the original prototype
of
> this breed from years ago...the things that were acceptable..we don't find
> acceptable today. Therefore..if you don't dilligently cultivate these
> desirable traits.you will loose them..or they will be difficult to regain.
> ..I feel most all-breed style dogs represent more of the "norm"..or
> moderate to even less than moderate dog. The moderate dog can be produced
> even when the sire and dam are specialty type dogs..on the flip side..two
> dogs moderate in movement and structure bred together will not as often
> produce specialty style dogs..it can happen( because of dogs that may
> factor in from the 3rd and 4th generations).this is why when you are
trying
> to make a moderate dog look like a specialty producer...you carefully
> select bitches that are to the extreme of the specialty style..plus have
> good producing animals behind them to override the tendency for
moderation.
> to me..this why breeding the GSD is a balancing act..and a difficult one
at
> that to master.C.Grainger
>
> > [Original Message]
> > From:
> > To:
> > Cc:
> > Date: 4/15/2005 8:59:43 AM
> > Subject: [ SHOWGSD-L ] Re: was small National entry? / two "types"
> >
> > I think Christine is absolutely accurate in her approach to evaluating
> the
> > GSD.All of the points she brings up are essential to a good show dog My
> > feeling is that a good dog should have correct type, and this is often
> demonstrated
> > in the AB ring. I think a Sociality dog just needs a little more
movement
> to
> > make him/her ( in these days of required political correctness) a
> specialty
> > dog. In the past we have seen many AB dogs with not so hot toplines and
> only
> > adequate side movement.
> > Hopefully those days are gone forever ,.
> > I find this totally ironic that I am "preaching type " to the shepherd
> line
> > and at the same time fighting like hell with the Pembroke Welsh Corgi
> people
> > about their firm stand that TYPE is of the utmost importance. One very
> > successful Corgi breeder has put in writing that he puts 35 to 40% on
> the head
> > alone...That's NOT what the standard says, but he wins everything..Even
> when we put
> > the now retired dog, Fxlor Schafrhaus Sammy Sosa in the ring, and he is
> > considered the best moving corgi yet, the corgi fancy bred 58 bitches to
> an import
> > who can NOT move, nor does he produce movers, and Sammy was bred to 3
> bitches in
> > the mean time????????? Sammy produced two litters of 5 champions
each!!!!!
> >
> >
>
> > Chuck Kruger....
> >
> >
> >
>
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>
>
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> POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the
original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS
of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author
AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED.
>
> ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY
MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS
PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY
FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE
PROSECUTED.
>
> For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx
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>
>
>
> Terry Cochran
> www.FairwayShepherds.com
> www.Rightdog.com RightDog Photography
>
> ---------------------------------
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>
============================================================================
> POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the
original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS
of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author
AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED.
>
> ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY
MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS
PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY
FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE
PROSECUTED.
>
> For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx
>
> VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://www.showgsd.org
>
============================================================================
============================================================================
POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the original
author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind
are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the
Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED.
ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY
MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS
PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY
FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE
PROSECUTED.
For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx
VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://www.showgsd.org
============================================================================
Terry Cochran
www.FairwayShepherds.com
www.Rightdog.com RightDog Photography
---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site!
============================================================================
POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the original
author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind
are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the
Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED.
ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY
MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS
PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY
FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE
PROSECUTED.
For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx
VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://www.showgsd.org
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