[gha] Re: [HumanRights] Samer near death and more + Your Joint Article aboit Intefaith Harmony of Palestinian and Jewish nations

  • From: Takis Ioannides <takis.ioannides@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: gha@xxxxxxxxxxxxx, Leo Semashko <leo.semashko@xxxxxxxxx>, Hedva Bachrach <hedgad@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, moriikae <moriikae@xxxxxxxxx>, peace-from-harmony@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, mazin@xxxxxxxxxxxx
  • Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2013 17:59:11 +0200

Dearest all, brothers & sisters in soul,

I think that we must etsablish the co-existance, the respect to religion
beliefs  - political and ethnic rights, tradation, way of living
 everywhere on planet Earth.
We are all brothers and sisters, but all above cause arguments and hard
words between persons who belive and gight for the global Peace, Love &

Based on the current status and actions of hummanity, I cokme to conlusion
that hummanity is still not ready to undertsand and perform peace - love -

Unfortunatelly for us the logic humans, the animals prove that are closer
to respect the diferent. I attach a video for it, in this note.

My father's ascestor's graves are in Pontos district, in the present
Turkiye. Should I start a war to take back these lands,
or I have to live in peace and harmony with my neighbours Turkiyes?
Greeks according to Plato were living all around Medditerrnian sea in very
big num,bers, like the frogs around  alike, as he said.
Should I start a war with all nations living there?
Slaves came in balkan Greek lands after 700 a.C. Should I start a war to
take back these lands?
WAR is a word which must be disappeared from all languages and our life for
ever. That's a dream of mine and yours years now. Is that effective today?
My father and my mother gamilies lost too many members in the wars...
But both my parents teach me even today in the age of 58 (they still see me
as child) to help, to love, to protect, to be usefull in the global and
local community.

Let's act all together for our common targets of love, co-existance, peace,
harmony. or else there is noone one else to do it.

withg love and respect
takis ioannides, student of this Life

2013/2/22 Mazin Qumsiyeh <mazin@xxxxxxxxxxxx>

> I first must tell you that I resent the orientalist and demeaning attitude
> that you have Leo.  You are not some disinterested third party here and you
> know it. But even if you try to project that you are independent, you need
> to respect others and not try to lecture us.  So please respect our
> feelings.  For example what is this about telling us to review your
> website.  I never dictate to people that they have to do certain things and
> I do not like to be dictated to let alone insulted by the condescending
> language that you used to suggest that somehow you are the "uncle" who
> knows peace and we are the children who must behave according to your
> standards..
> As for my plan for peace, I did that ten years ago in my book called
> sharing the Land of Canaan.  You can read it at
> http://qumsiyeh.org/sharingthelandofcanaan/ but you could have googled
> and found that and many other writings and organizations that we do for
> peace (Including the FACT that I was chair of the Palestinian Center for
> Rapprochement Between People).  So please respect us even if you are a
> Zionist who disagrees with us.
> By the way, I am now in a tour of several European cities with Dr. Jeff
> Halper (Israeli) speaking precisely about the future, a joint future for
> all of  us.  The trip is organized by Faculty for Israeli Palestinian
> Peace.  I am in Grenoble now where we just spoke to 150 people and tomorrow
> we go to Geneva.
> As for Hedeva: I thank you for articulating your views (which ofcourse I
> disagree with as do most Israeli and International historians).  I do not
> want to debate via email so I will not respond.  I would be happy to hold a
> public dialogue with you any where and anytime.  Of course the Israeli
> occupation/apartheid authorties prevent most Palestinians from going to
> most of  occupied Palestine including Jerusalem so I am limited to the
> ghetto/people warehouse of Bethlehem.  But there are always ways around
> apartheid walls and checkpoints for all of us (you included).  So we should
> get together and have  a public dialogue for real peace and harmony (which
> must be based on Justice and Human Rights)
> Sincerely
> Mazin
> On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 9:24 AM, Leo Semashko <leo.semashko@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>  Dear Hedva and Mazin,
>> You write that you nations had 8 wars during 64 years. It's very sad. But
>> why is this happening?
>> I think the reason is that you only think about the war. We did not read
>> any more of your page dedicated to 100% peace between your peoples. In this
>> state of your minds you will have 80 more wars during 640 years. And so on
>> to infinity.
>> WHO established peace between you and your nations, if you think and
>> write only about the war? WHO? Jean of Rwanda? Leo from Russia? Kae from
>> Japan? - No one but you. This requires that you start to think and write
>> about peace.
>> I invited you twice and now I ask for the third and last time to write:
>> 1. Short, up to 1 page review on *the ABC of Harmony*, which is designed
>> for world peace (www.peacefromharmony.org/?cat=en_c&key=478), and 2. the
>> 2-3 pages of your ideas about peace, about how maybe peace among of your
>> peoples. I and GHA will only discuss like your writings and no other.
>> Both of you accuse me in disrespect. However, your persistent ignore all
>> my letters with my invitations that is disrespectful to me and the GHA. You
>> write me “long letters that did not address the peaceful substance of my
>> letters”. I will not respond to such emails. Yes, GHA can not respect your
>> militarist writings. We can only respect your peacemaking writings. But we
>> do not see them. Please, show them to us.
>> Best harmony wishes,
>> Leo
>> Dr Leo Semashko:
>> State  Councillor  of  St.  Petersburg,
>> Philosopher, Sociologist and Peacemaker from Harmony;
>> Director:  Tetrasociology Public Institute, Russia;
>> Founding President, Global Harmony Association (GHA);
>> Director, GHA Website "Peace from Harmony": www.peacefromharmony.org
>> World Interfaith Harmony Project on the ABC of Harmony Base:
>> www.peacefromharmony.org/?cat=en_c&key=541;
>> GHA Program Book, The ABC of Harmony:
>> www.peacefromharmony.org/?cat=en_c&key=478;
>> P/Web page: www.peacefromharmony.org/?cat=en_c&key=253;
>> Address: 7/4-42 Ho-Shi-Min Street, St. Petersburg 194356, Russia
>> Phone: 7 (812) 597-65-71; Skype: leo.semahko
>> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/leo.semashko?ref=tn_tnmn
>> ----- Original Message -----
>>   From: Hedva Bachrach, hedgad@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>   To: leo.semashko@xxxxxxxxx
>>   Sent: 20 февраля 2013 г., 12:53:59
>>   Subject: [HumanRights] Samer near death and more + Your Joint Article
>> aboit Intefaith Harmony of Palestinian and Jewish nations
>> On 20/02/2013 10:50, Hedva Bachrach wrote:
>> On 20/02/2013 10:32, Hedva Bachrach wrote:
>> On 19/02/2013 19:12, Mazin Qumsiyeh wrote:
>> Dear all  , *an answer to Mr. Qumsiyeh, and everybody..
>> In Israel we are 7-8 million people. about 6 million Jewish people*.* Half
>> of our number 47% are originally refugees from Arab and Magreb Moslem
>> countries who fled to Israel after the 1948 war, as they were threatened by
>> angry mobs for their lives.
>> I do not understand how Mr. Mazin who claims he is for the peace between
>> Israelis and Palestinians wants to bring 7 million refugees to our
>> country.. It is funny that every year this number of refugees grows.. as
>> grows the number of villages to the incredible number of 530 villages. Even
>> with the Jewish townships and villages there were not so many in 1948. When
>> Barak offered Arafaat to return even half Jerusalem and palestinian
>> territories, Arafaat did not agree unless 4-5 millions refugees  return,
>> which we can not accept to undermine our demographic structure. And more so
>> - as so many Jews, even more than the Palestinian 1 million people who fled
>> away in war time, and afterwards many more Jews from Arab and Moslem
>> countries around fled to Israel. Israel is not responsible for the behavior
>> of their own brothers, in Arab countries, towards refugees. So many Arab
>> countries could easily give citizen's rights to Palestinians dispersed
>> among them for 64 years. Most of States give citizenship after 5 or 10
>> years. How is it that Arafaats 4 -5 millions suddenly turned out in 10
>> years to be 7 millions????? Israel wanted to receive some and to give
>> monetary recompense  to the others, But no....
>> I'm tired of exchanging "endearing words" with Mr Qumsiyeh, who mainly
>> deals with propaganda.. I enclose here for everybody to read what I've
>> written in my 15 pages that Mr. Qumsiyeh was so offended by it. I wish him
>> a very good life, but not on our account. Israel is our only home in the
>> world. No one can take it from us. I am against the settlement policy, I've
>> written about the problematic aspects of this situation in my attached
>> letter. Unlike Mr. Qumsiyeh I was thinking in my letter about the
>> Palestinians too..
>> To all of you, a good year and a good life..
>> Hedva
>> *I wrote the email below to explain why I am not entering into a
>> "discussion".  I realized there is a forum called "Peace from Harmony" and
>> Leo now added me to this forum.  I now share this letter to the forum.
>>  Please note I am chairman of the Palestinian Center for Rapprochement
>> Between People; the first center to bring Israelis and Palestinians
>> together to work for peace (not for normalizing colonization or
>> occupation).  We are 12 million Palestinians, 7 million of us are refugees
>> or displaced people. 530 villages and towns were ethnically cleansed
>> between 1948-1950.  The first step to peace is to join the hundreds of
>> thousands of us (Israelis and Palestinians) to insist on implementing the
>> internationally recognized rights of all Palestinian refugees to return to
>> their homes and lands from which they were ethnically cleansed.  I am sure
>> Leo would have reacted the same way as I did if he had been around in 1940
>> and someone approached him to reconcile based on harmony (with no justice)
>> with Nazis who were killing so many people.  Peace/harmony without reality
>> or justice is meaningless or is an illusion.
>> Hedva chose to respond by a long letter that did not address the
>> substance of my letter but merely attack me personally (as hateful etc).  I
>> find this only a validation of the facts stated in my message.  As I and
>> fellow Israeli peace activists get arrested regularly by the apartheid
>> regime, it is sad that Leo and Hedva chose to line up behind tribal notions
>> and project their emotions on others instead of dealing honestly with the
>> substance of reality,
>> I hope you will allow my message through to the list if you are really
>> interested in truth and harmony and that you all will read the links
>> provided below and respond rationally and without tribalistic emotions.
>> Dear Leo
>> The article you shared is simply a regurgitation of mythologies that even
>> intelligent Zionists have long abandoned.  Even a Zionist historian like
>> Benny Morris documented the processes of history that surrounded the
>> creation of Israel etc.  But even the regurgitation was done rather crudely
>> and without much thought or even proper language.  It is actually rather
>> childish rants similar to those that the extremist settlers in Hebron say
>> as they attack native Palestinians, foreign visitors, diplomats, and media.
>> Mr Hedva would do well to read a bit of history so that his propaganda
>> efforts would be a little more credible and perhaps worthy of an
>> individualized response.  For answers to his myths and many more similar
>> myths, may I suggest he look at this http://qumsiyeh.org/liesandtruths/
>> Now for the issue of harmony between religions and nations etc.  That is
>> a more worthy issue.  But there are many books and voluminous articles
>> written on the subject.  I myself wrote two books and over 100 articles
>> that deal with the subject and published in many widely read journals etc.
>> I also read many other books and can recommend a few including by Jewish
>> intellectuals (e.g. Marc Ellis, Out of the Ashes; Mark Braverman, Judas
>> Magnes, etc). See also
>> http://qumsiyeh.org/openletterbygeorgesalzman/
>> http://qumsiyeh.org/answertorosenfeld/
>> http://qumsiyeh.org/einsteinetalonbegin/
>> I do not believe in reinventing the wheel. Perhaps publishing some of the
>> existing articles or selections from the existing books on your website
>> maybe helpful to your readers.
>> Finally, I caution people from equating oppressed with oppressor,
>> colonized with colonizers.  This is a common error and a tool of the
>> oppressor.  In South Africa under apartheid, the struggle was not between
>> black and white people but between those who supported apartheid (black and
>> white) and those who opposed it (black and white).  In the struggles in
>> Europe between 1932-1945 it was not between a "German Nation" and a "Jewish
>> nation" but between humans who opposed racism and those who supported it
>> (including leading Zionists who collaborated with Nazi Germany*).
>> * See Jewish authors Lenni Brenner, 51 Documents: History of Nazi Zionist
>> Collaboration; Edwin Black, The Transfer Agreement; Norman Finkelstein, The
>> Holocaust Industry; Naeim Giladi, Ben Gurion's scandals)
>> Best

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