On 19/02/2013 19:12, Mazin Qumsiyeh wrote:
Dear all , *an answer to Mr. Qumsiyeh, and everybody..*
*In Israel we are 7-8 million people. about 6 million Jewish people*.*Half of our number 47% are originally refugees from Arab and Magreb Moslem countries who fled to Israel after the 1948 war, as they were threatened by angry mobs for their lives.
I do not understand how Mr. Mazin who claims he is for the peace between Israelis and Palestinians wants to bring 7 million refugees to our country.. It is funny that every year this number of refugees grows.. as grows the number of villages to the incredible number of 530 villages. Even with the Jewish townships and villages there were not so many in 1948. When Barak offered Arafaat to return even half Jerusalem and palestinian territories, Arafaat did not agree unless 4-5 millions refugees return, which we can not accept to undermine our demographic structure. And more so - as so many Jews, even more than the Palestinian 1 million people who fled away in war time, and afterwards many more Jews from Arab and Moslem countries around fled to Israel. Israel is not responsible for the behavior of their own brothers, in Arab countries, towards refugees. So many Arab countries could easily give citizen's rights to Palestinians dispersed among them for 64 years. Most of States give citizenship after 5 or 10 years. How is it that Arafaats 4 -5 millions suddenly turned out in 10 years to be 7 millions????? Israel wanted to receive some and to give monetary recompense to the others, But no....
I'm tired of exchanging "endearing words" with Mr Qumsiyeh, who mainly deals with propaganda.. I enclose here for everybody to read what I've written in my 15 pages that Mr. Qumsiyeh was so offended by it. I wish him a very good life, but not on our account. Israel is our only home in the world. No one can take it from us. I am against the settlement policy, I've written about the problematic aspects of this situation in my attached letter. Unlike Mr. Qumsiyeh I was thinking in my letter about the Palestinians too..
To all of you, a good year and a good life.. Hedva *
I wrote the email below to explain why I am not entering into a "discussion". I realized there is a forum called "Peace from Harmony" and Leo now added me to this forum. I now share this letter to the forum. Please note I am chairman of the Palestinian Center for Rapprochement Between People; the first center to bring Israelis and Palestinians together to work for peace (not for normalizing colonization or occupation). We are 12 million Palestinians, 7 million of us are refugees or displaced people. 530 villages and towns were ethnically cleansed between 1948-1950. The first step to peace is to join the hundreds of thousands of us (Israelis and Palestinians) to insist on implementing the internationally recognized rights of all Palestinian refugees to return to their homes and lands from which they were ethnically cleansed. I am sure Leo would have reacted the same way as I did if he had been around in 1940 and someone approached him to reconcile based on harmony (with no justice) with Nazis who were killing so many people. Peace/harmony without reality or justice is meaningless or is an illusion.Hedva chose to respond by a long letter that did not address the substance of my letter but merely attack me personally (as hateful etc). I find this only a validation of the facts stated in my message. As I and fellow Israeli peace activists get arrested regularly by the apartheid regime, it is sad that Leo and Hedva chose to line up behind tribal notions and project their emotions on others instead of dealing honestly with the substance of reality,I hope you will allow my message through to the list if you are really interested in truth and harmony and that you all will read the links provided below and respond rationally and without tribalistic emotions.Dear LeoThe article you shared is simply a regurgitation of mythologies that even intelligent Zionists have long abandoned. Even a Zionist historian like Benny Morris documented the processes of history that surrounded the creation of Israel etc. But even the regurgitation was done rather crudely and without much thought or even proper language. It is actually rather childish rants similar to those that the extremist settlers in Hebron say as they attack native Palestinians, foreign visitors, diplomats, and media. Mr Hedva would do well to read a bit of history so that his propaganda efforts would be a little more credible and perhaps worthy of an individualized response. For answers to his myths and many more similar myths, may I suggest he look at this http://qumsiyeh.org/liesandtruths/Now for the issue of harmony between religions and nations etc. That is a more worthy issue. But there are many books and voluminous articles written on the subject. I myself wrote two books and over 100 articles that deal with the subject and published in many widely read journals etc. I also read many other books and can recommend a few including by Jewish intellectuals (e.g. Marc Ellis, Out of the Ashes; Mark Braverman, Judas Magnes, etc). See alsohttp://qumsiyeh.org/openletterbygeorgesalzman/ http://qumsiyeh.org/answertorosenfeld/ http://qumsiyeh.org/einsteinetalonbegin/I do not believe in reinventing the wheel. Perhaps publishing some of the existing articles or selections from the existing books on your website maybe helpful to your readers.Finally, I caution people from equating oppressed with oppressor, colonized with colonizers. This is a common error and a tool of the oppressor. In South Africa under apartheid, the struggle was not between black and white people but between those who supported apartheid (black and white) and those who opposed it (black and white). In the struggles in Europe between 1932-1945 it was not between a "German Nation" and a "Jewish nation" but between humans who opposed racism and those who supported it (including leading Zionists who collaborated with Nazi Germany*).* See Jewish authors Lenni Brenner, 51 Documents: History of Nazi Zionist Collaboration; Edwin Black, The Transfer Agreement; Norman Finkelstein, The Holocaust Industry; Naeim Giladi, Ben Gurion's scandals)Best
The two aspects of the Israeli.docx
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