Me In blue.. ----- Original Message ---- From: philip madsen <pma15027@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Monday, May 5, 2008 3:59:24 PM Subject: [geocentrism] Re: acceleration calcs attachment Phil..if there is a change from 30 gms to 0 grms (as detected on our scale).....then we have a change. that change is due to going from 0 velocity to some other velocity, Allen Not so! And that is where you try to force your false imagination upon us.. 1. If the scale showed 30 gms before the drop ...then we drop and then the scale shows 0 grms....that by deffinition is a change....the cause of that change can only be shown to be the fact that we were first hanging with no velocity and then begining to move at a velocity other then what we were hanging at!!!.....Then demonstrate not just assert what the cause of the change was......When we had 0 velocity then we have 32 ft per sec per sec going from 0 to 32ft per sec per sec is what caused the change...Your the one imagigning that the states of weigtlessness and velocity are reversed.!?.... ....PHIL your the one imagining weitlessness is due to the absense of physical conection?..wonder how gravity knows so much???? The change to weightlessness occurs AT zero velocity, at the exact same moment of separation.. before the fall commences.. 2. Untill you can demonstrate that all the accelerations inside of a object/ accelerometer take place identicaly and simoltaniously, then your argument is only assuming the very thing you are attempting to prove!Weightlessness does not always happen at the instant of the drop..period!..proof?......To obtain the state of weightlessness is a process over time in free fall not a instant event! the vomit comet and roller coasters demonstrate this..and the fact that we would then be weightless wrt the earth while in free fall in the suns gravitational feild.....!? There is no differnce between our scale in our elevator faling to earth and a scale on earth falling to the sun!? .Anything attached to the scale will show the 30 gms to get lighter and lighter over a period of time through the drop, untill both the scale and the weight attached to it obtain the same accelerations..... only then will you have reached weightlessness.. but they do not inialy have the same accelerations in fact that is what you have to demonstrate first before you assume it is true! Untill it does, it will have a coresponding weight. Phil, That is why how fast you go down in a elevator or over the top on a roller coaster determines how much much weightlesness you "feel"....!? the accelerations in free fall of any mass are not identical to every part of that mass.... if it were there could be no tides....oh wait..... you dont agree with MS on the cause of the tides either do you?!.. Please tell me how does gravity affect and what is the cause the tides?.............Like the hovering of the thrown up ball.. At the peak of the curve when velocity is zero, weightlessness occurs. like the peak of a roller coaster when we go from weightless to detectable accelerations in free falll over the top!.....NO phil my position is not imaginary yours is! wow now you realy should be able to develope anti gravity machines ....Just don't touch anything and according to you we will be weigtless?! Do you deny this momentary stationary weightlessness. umpteenth chance Phil. ----- Original Message ----- From: Allen Daves To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2008 8:03 AM Subject: [geocentrism] Re: acceleration calcs attachment philip said: thanks to Paul he did the work for me and showed how Allen sidesteps logic to keep an impossible conversation going.......Yes Thanks Paul I think your postion and what you base your arguments on is quite clear to everyone now...:-) Actualy Phil, Paul stated "Second, I'm not really interested in logic " so im not sure how he showed me to sidestep logic, he is not even interested in using it........LOL Notice the accusation of us being stupid..NO, I accused you then as well as now of ignoring evaluations of observations within logic secondly preferring imaginations external of facts or observations with a almost zealot like stubbornness to "keep the faith" regardless of what contradictions and inconsistencies it produces....thirdly that you invoke your conclusions as the bases for all your evaluations that are supposed to demonstrate your conclusions.......that is called a circular fallacy but then again who cares about logic we are only here for "scientific discussion" ryt?!.....LOL ignoring that I said the change noticed was a state of weightlessness.. not a change of velocity.. Phil..if there is a change from 30 gms to 0 grms (as detected on our scale).....then we have a change. that change is due to going from 0 velocity to some other velocity, .............. as is the case with a suspended elevator i mentioned ................That is a not only just a change in the velocity of the elevator but a change in velocity wrt magnitude which is an acceleration by definition... and it was detectable...I also addressed what happens once we are in free fall and then change from 32 ft per sec/ per sec in any given direction and explained& demonstrated why and how even assuming MS's own constructs................