In a message dated 12/16/05 12:06:55 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, sally@xxxxxxxxxxx writes: I would certainly agree that things are not the way they should be- whether it is happening in your area or you just are not aware of it. Some of our big winners are being "adjusted" whether it is color, teeth or elbows - it is going on- We have dogs dieing before their time. There are a lot of puppies dieing from certain lines - Missing teeth are becoming more common , spinal problems are too. If we can not admit this the breed will go down fast- There are cartels(for lack of a better name) If a dog wins under one they are going to win under most of the others. Certain handlers do dominate whether the dog deserves it or not. Sticking our head in the sand is not going to change anything- If you have been around long enough you have seen this happen before - then we cycle out of it- But we can not sit and do nothing about it Very easy answer. Get a better dog. I noticed this too, and was gnashing my teeth at every show. Then I started to show O'Connor. Amazing how it resolved the problems. The judges got smarter, the shows were more fun, the winners were better quality, none of the puppies have missing teeth, and no one is dying any more. My dog was not colored, fixed or adjusted. And none of the shows were won by inferior dogs. What an easy solution that was. Evan (http://www.asgardgsd.com/) Asgard German Shepherds http://www.asgardgsd.com/ Where Type Movement and Temperament come together ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://www.showgsd.org ============================================================================