[lit-ideas] Re: The de-islamization of Europe
- From: "Lawrence Helm" <lawrencehelm@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2007 14:17:49 -0800
Phil,
Gauchet in The Disenchantment of the World, takes the influence further than
you do. I recall that you read Gauchet but can't recall whether you
commented upon him. Gauchet argued that all of the Christian benevolences
have been taken over by the secular state. These now are embodied in
Liberal Democracy. Christianity took care of the poor, the sick, and the
prisoner. Now Liberal Democratic states do that. Are there any Christian
benevolences that the State hasn't taken over?
Also, an argument has been made by others that Marx was equally influenced
by Christianity. He thought he could create a system that could be more
benevolent than any system that existed.
And so Christianity is reduced to the rituals, the not forsaking to gather
together, the subscription to the creeds and dogma (although there is some
difference of opinion about how to interpret them), but as to how one
functions out in the world, well we ought to be as salt and light but if we
fall too far short we have Liberal Democratic laws (rather than Christian
discipline) to reprimand us - and these laws for the most part do not
conflict with Christian principles.
Lawrence
-----Original Message-----
From: lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Phil Enns
Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2007 12:13 PM
To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: The de-islamization of Europe
Andreas Ramos wrote:
"Nobody could possibly say that Christianity encouraged modern society or
liberal democracy."
I would trace the ideal of liberal democracy back to Luther's credo 'Sola
fide', and so happily claim that Christianity lay the foundations for
liberal democracy. (This is not to make the claim that Christianity is the
foundation for liberal democracy.) By insisting on the individual's ability
to be the final arbiter of faith, Luther laid the foundation for the liberal
democratic notion that each citizen is the final arbiter of their pursuit of
the good. The final authority for an individual's goals and ideals lies not
with a prince or religious figure, but the individual.
When Luther failed to show the same courage towards the princes as he had
toward the Pope, by allowing the princes to determine the faith within their
realms, the Radical Reformation was formed. This continuation of the
reformation ideal then insisted that there ought to be a separation between
the sacred and secular realm, leading to the separation of church and state.
The beliefs that each individual is responsible for their own ends and that
matters of faith must be separated from matters of politics form two of the
cornerstones of liberal democracy.
Sincerely,
Phil Enns
Glen Haven, NS
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