[vipaudioaccess] Re: Hsc sets with sonar

  • From: Chris Smart <csmart8@xxxxxxxxx>
  • To: vipaudioaccess@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  • Date: Thu, 09 Feb 2017 12:11:32 -0500

yes, rounding errors can pile up. Yes, some of us can hear things more than others. Heck, old CRT displays used to be physically painful to me when I was younger. Now, the same sound is still audible, but not annoyingly so.

We can go back and forth on this forever, as long as we are just saying "I think it sounds better than this other thing." See my other post on ABX testing if you want to have some fun actually seeing if any of us can in fact hear a difference.


At 11:11 AM 2/9/2017, you wrote:

I get your point Michael, but that analogy was to point out that some coders will have written code differently, even though they ended up with the same outcome.
Now your maths analogy is probably better. Yes 2+2 = 4, but what if someone wrote 2+3-1 = 4? It’s still the same, but done differently. Imagine that on an incredibly complex scale and I’m sure you’ll agree there will be some mistakes/bugs. It’s that that has an impact on the end result.
Maybe all of us may not be able to hear the difference, but that doesn’t mean some will. The same way we can’t hear ultra high frequencies...just because we can’t doesn’t mean they are not there. It’s a fact that children/young adults can hear frequencies that an adult can’t. It begins to disappear around the age of 19/20 or something like that. So, I do believe there are differences. Steve.

From: <mailto:AI5HF@xxxxxxxxxxx>Michael Taboada
Sent: Thursday, February 09, 2017 11:44 AM
To: <mailto:vipaudioaccess@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>vipaudioaccess@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [vipaudioaccess] Re: Hsc sets with sonar


Hi Steve,

I see your point, though I see only one thing wrong with it: With digital audio, there's one way to get there. Period. You can code your engine more efficiently, for sure, but there's still only one way to get there. The algorithm is clear, and if you don't follow it, I'm sorry, but your software is broken. Just my $0.02.

-Michael.





----------
From: vipaudioaccess-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <vipaudioaccess-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> on behalf of Steve Spamer <stevespamer68@xxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, February 9, 2017 6:18 AM
To: vipaudioaccess@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [vipaudioaccess] Re: Hsc sets with sonar

Michael, on the surface of it that seems to be the case, but if you think about it, all these different audio engines are coded by different people. So, even though they are all ending up at the same destination...it’s all about how they get there.

If you got a cab to go on a 1 mile journey, that cab driver could probably cover anything from 1 mile to whatever, depending on which direction they go. Now if you got in that cab and they drove off in a totally crazy direction...and you end up covering 3 miles, then I’m guessing you wouldn’t be happy, as you would be paying for 3 miles instead of 1. It’s the same with audio engines (excuse the pun
Smile
), some are more efficient and accurate and this has an affect on the result. Steve.

From: <mailto:AI5HF@xxxxxxxxxxx>Michael Taboada
Sent: Thursday, February 09, 2017 11:03 AM
To: <mailto:vipaudioaccess@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>vipaudioaccess@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [vipaudioaccess] Re: Hsc sets with sonar


I can see many people seem to think this, but the way I see it, a DAW is essentially a really fancy calculator. If you put in 4+4 into your calculator, and I put in 4+4 to mine, they should both come out to 8, no matter who made them. If they don't, something is horribly wrong with one of them. I also think that coloring the audio, which I would think would have to be intensional, is a really bad idea. What if you don't want the color a DAW provides, assuming it does provide a color? Well then you're basically screwed out of using that DAW. It should be up to the producer to color the audio the way they want it. That's what things like ozone, neutron, etc are for. I would still be interested in a NULL test, as, from what I've read, something as simple as having a different default panning law can have a drastic difference on the quality or "color" of the audio. I might have to do this myself to find out.

-Michael.





----------
From: vipaudioaccess-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <vipaudioaccess-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> on behalf of Jean-Philippe Rykiel <jprykiel@xxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, February 9, 2017 2:59 AM
To: vipaudioaccess@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [vipaudioaccess] Re: Hsc sets with sonar

Dear Michael,

You could think that the only thing that matters to sound quality is
your sound card. I used to think this to.

But the difference between DAWs becomes more obvious with the number of
tracks in your project. Each DAW seems to have its own way of summing
tracks in the digital domain.

Also, Samplitude has much better built-in Equalisers and dynamic
processing Than the version of sonar we can use had. And, Samplitude has
something I love which is automatic cross fade each time you punch, cut
or paste. in 99% cases you don't have to worry about zero crossings any
more which is a big time saver.

I still like sonar for its MIDI part, but I will be using Samplitude for
audio from now on.

For the record, I did a little test, a blind test if you like, with
these two fines you can listen to here.

Same thing recorded in sonar and Samplitude, and I don't say which is which.

<https://www.dropbox.com/s/hl6qhyooiwhd7w9/sonar%20or%20sam.zip?dl=0>https://www.dropbox.com/s/hl6qhyooiwhd7w9/sonar%20or%20sam.zip?dl=0
<https://www.dropbox.com/s/hl6qhyooiwhd7w9/sonar%20or%20sam.zip?dl=0>
[]

<https://www.dropbox.com/s/hl6qhyooiwhd7w9/sonar%20or%20sam.zip?dl=0>sonar or sam.zip
www.dropbox.com
Shared with Dropbox


Have a listen.
Best,
JPR
PS, A big hello to Raul, so nice to have you here.

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Le 09/02/2017 à 00:42, Michael Taboada a écrit :
> I'd be interested to see if someone had done a null test on samplitude versus sonar, as there is quite a bit of an argument as to whether daws in general can actually sound different from each other. I'm of the opinion that any daw Will get the work done, as long as it's programmed properly, and any differences are probably down to user error, etc. rather than a daw actually sounding different. But like I said, there is a lot of argument about this.
> Michael.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Feb 8, 2017, at 4:31 PM, Phil Muir <info@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>
>> JSonar works enough on Windows 10 for me to get a bit of work done E.G. get
>> old projects out of it.  Wouldn't mix in Sonar now if you paid me as it
>> doesn't sound that great and won't work in Sonar at all now if I can help
>> it.  Record, mix and master in Samplitude Pro X3 Suite.  It's like going
>> from 2D to 3D mixing.  Samplitude sounds absolutely fantastic!!
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: vipaudioaccess-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> [<mailto:vipaudioaccess-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>mailto:vipaudioaccess-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Neville Peter
>> Sent: 08 February 2017 17:20
>> To: vipaudioaccess@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: [vipaudioaccess] Re: Hsc sets with sonar
>>
>>
>> Hey Phil,
>> Does Sonar 8.5 work on Windows 10 with J Sonar?
>>
>> Does J Sonar offer the same accessibility on Windows 10 as CT on Windows 7?
>>
>> I thought that accessibility in Sonar was a thing of the pass, since there
>> is no longer a Windows Classic theme for Windows 10. am I wrong? Is there
>> accessibility in Windows 10 even without the Windows classic theme?
>>
>>
>> May the Peace of God which passes all understanding guard your heart and
>> mind in Christ Jesus.
>>
>> Music Soft Sacred and Soulful
>>
>> HTTP://:nevillepeter.Com
>>
>>
>>> On Feb 8, 2017, at 10:32 AM, Phil Muir <info@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> wrote:
>>> You do on Windows 10 as Cake Talking doesn't support that.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: vipaudioaccess-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> [<mailto:vipaudioaccess-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>mailto:vipaudioaccess-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Raul Midon
>>> Sent: 08 February 2017 03:25
>>> To: vipaudioaccess@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Subject: [vipaudioaccess] Hsc sets with sonar
>>>
>>> Hello everyone
>>> I am still using sonar 8.5 and it is working well for me.
>>> Do I need J sonar to use HSC?
>>> Thanks
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