[SI-LIST] Re: EMI simulation tools at PCB level
- From: "Kai Keskinen" <kalevi@xxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <Chris.Cheng@xxxxxxxxxxxx>, "'Charles Grasso '" <cgrassosprint1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>, <zhang_kun@xxxxxxxxxx>, <si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 16:27:04 -0500
If you combined a tool like FlowEMC with a tool like SpecctraQuest or
Hyperlynx, with a logic simulator that allowed you to exercise the
board/system in a fully functional manner, so that the simulated ibis
devices were triggering at the right timing intervals and sending their
voltages/currents down the simulated tracks with the simulated planes/shapes
and sucking up and sourcing current through the simulated power delivery
system, in the simulated housing/shelf/frame with the attached I/O and power
cables, you could in theory get some reasonably accurate emissions profiles
for your board/housing/shelf/system if direct emissions from the chip
packages were ignored. You would also need massive memory and cpu capacity.
I apologize for the run on sentence.
By properly using SI tools, EMC tools, and your experience, you can design
to minimize EMI and EMC susceptibility as well as quickly troubleshoot for
EMI/EMC failures. Every design is a balance between meeting
functionality/specs and cost. The design tools let you understand and
evaluate the compromises so that you can meet your design requirements at
the minimum cost ($, space, weight, power, ...).
Cheers,
-----Original Message-----
From: si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Chris Cheng
Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 2:13 AM
To: 'Charles Grasso '; Chris Cheng; 'zhang_kun@xxxxxxxxxx ';
'si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx '
Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: EMI simulation tools at PCB level
You mean the =22 part ? :-D
Seriously, I know it is understandable and explainable but I want it to be
automatically predicted and simulated by a tool. It is easy to fix and patch
after the fact but I have yet to see a tool to tell me ahead of time the db
and peaks location. A bare PCB with a few "experimental traces" as in some
EMI papers, sure. A multi-boards system with chassis and spaghetti cables
come out ? Show me the money.
-----Original Message-----
From: Charles Grasso
To: Chris.Cheng@xxxxxxxxxxxx; zhang_kun@xxxxxxxxxx; si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: 12/2/2004 10:31 PM
Subject: RE: [SI-LIST] Re: EMI simulation tools at PCB level
Chris - It would be *much* easier for you to contact some experienced
EMC
engineers - the phenomena you describe are understandabe and
explainable.
-----Original Message-----
From: si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Chris Cheng
Sent: Thursday, December 02, 2004 5:13 PM
To: 'zhang_kun@xxxxxxxxxx'; si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: EMI simulation tools at PCB level
I am sure the consumer product guys will laugh at my stupidity but I can
never design a PCB that will pass FCC B without a large metal cage
chassis.
I've always wanted to simulate why if I tighten the screw by one more
turn
on my door and my EMI gaskets compressed a little harder and the
signature
changed by 10 db. Or if I hang the cable this way or that way the
signature
changed by a few db. What I am trying to say is while EMI from PCB may
be
the source, the enclosure/environment the PCB is in seems to have a
bigger
impact on whether you are passing FCC than the PCB itself. Granted this
is
just from an incompetent designer like me who cannot ship an absolute
clean
PCB that can be wrapped in a plastic bag and passing FCC. Any simulation
tools that can help me ?
ps Is there any way I can receive messages from the list from outside
the US
without these =2 =22 ? I know the US or English language is not the
center
of the Universe so I appolgize in advanced.
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