Sean, I think that is the point of this being a private list. Nobody is out to defile judges. It is merely to give us the tools to make an educated decision as to what judge we should show our dogs under. To use your example: Say I have an awesome dog with a missing premolar. I know the judge doesn't worry about minor faults and will put a dog up that has everything else. Or: Say I have a dog is a little dirty going away or lifts in front or locked hocks. Wouldn't I want to know what judges would look at the other attrubutes my dog has? Or want to know the judges who want a clean dog with proper movement? Or: Say I am an owner/handler. Wouldn't I want to know who only looks at the face at the end of the lead and who looks at the DOG? Could be the other way around too :-) Plus it is a good way to get to know the judges and what they put up. It shouldn't be a gripe session. Just observations and experiences from others that will be provided upon request. I can only see that as a positive. ================================================================== Unfortunately, Laura, the reality is that we all have different perceptions and opinions as to what is movement, clean coming and going and proper movement. While I may think that my dog has better movement than the dog in front of it because it reached out a bit better, the judge may be looking at "going away". And then there is the issue of what the judge gets to see in the middle of the ring and what we, the outsiders, get to see on the outside of the ring. I have seen many well meaning exhibitors complain about what I thought was a perfectly good placing of animals because their "heart" was in one of the lower placings. A list of this sort would be a disservice to novice people that may believe "to the letter" the misconception of an opinionated owner. Sorry... I think the intentions were excellent but the execution would be a terrible mistake. As always, JMI. Dania ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://www.showgsd.org ============================================================================