Thanks Jackie and everyone else: I now have a load of information/tutorials. As I understand C++ is like a "new" version of C? Do I need to have a look at C before starting out with the C++ tutorials? -----Original Message----- From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Jackie McBride Sent: 1. juli 2010 21:22 To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Re: Programming Preferences Was RE: I feel like giving up on programming altogether! Oyvind, I'm not Tyler, but perhaps I'll do: http://mindview.net/Books/DownloadSites/ On 7/1/10, Øyvind Lode <oyvind.lode@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: > Tyler: > Where can I buy an accessible version of this book? > I don't have access to Safari or Bookshare. > > -----Original Message----- > From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Tyler > Littlefield > Sent: 1. juli 2010 18:50 > To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > Subject: Re: Programming Preferences Was RE: I feel like giving up on > programming altogether! > > Thinking in c++ by bruce eckel is an awesome book, skip the first chapter > about object oritentation because just starting out, it will make no sense, > and come back to that later. > Thanks, > Tyler Littlefield > http://tds-solutions.net > Twitter: sorressean > > On Jul 1, 2010, at 10:46 AM, Ken Perry wrote: > >> actually there are a lot of them but they don't have to be blind friendly. >> IN fact if you can get a hold of the Coronado c and c++ tutorials they are >> both about 12 chapters and yes you will even learn pointers from them. I >> think Jamal has a list of programming tutorials not sure though. I will > see >> if I can dig up the ones I suggest but I am currently at work. >> >> ken >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Øyvind Lode >> Sent: Thursday, July 01, 2010 11:11 AM >> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> Subject: RE: Programming Preferences Was RE: I feel like giving up on >> programming altogether! >> >> Joseph: >> A wonderful thought I must say :) >> I'd love to see a blind friendly tutorial in C/C++ that starts from the >> beginning. >> I don't mind using command lines and text editors. >> In fact I prefer it. >> But the tutorials I found for C# starts with designing a form in VS and >> dropping some buttons etc on it... >> So please make these tutorials a reality :) >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Joseph Lee >> Sent: 1. juli 2010 16:05 >> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> Subject: RE: Programming Preferences Was RE: I feel like giving up on >> programming altogether! >> >> Hi Ken and others, >> Something to consider; How about if we can write quite a few blind > friendly >> tutorials on programming? That way there would be a specific resource for >> beginners to learn how to program from blindness perspective. Just a >> thought. >> Cheers, >> Joseph >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Ken Perry >> Sent: Thursday, July 01, 2010 6:56 AM >> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> Subject: RE: Programming Preferences Was RE: I feel like giving up on >> programming altogether! >> >> I could if you want to learn. I actually have taught it before and I had >> the best teacher back in 1991 he worked for Word Perfect and I have never >> forgot his classes. >> >> Ken >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Homme, James >> Sent: Thursday, July 01, 2010 8:23 AM >> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> Subject: RE: Programming Preferences Was RE: I feel like giving up on >> programming altogether! >> >> Hi Ken, >> If you can teach me how pointers and references work, I will consider you > a >> genius. >> >> Jim >> >> Jim Homme, >> Usability Services, >> Phone: 412-544-1810. Skype: jim.homme >> Internal recipients, Read my accessibility blog. Discuss accessibility >> here. Accessibility Wiki: Breaking news and accessibility advice >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Stanzel, Susan > - >> Kansas City, MO >> Sent: Thursday, July 01, 2010 7:40 AM >> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> Subject: RE: Programming Preferences Was RE: I feel like giving up on >> programming altogether! >> >> Hi Listers, >> >> I have been a COBOL programmer since graduating from college in 1971. I > got >> a business degree with an emphasis in computer science after taking all 31 >> hours offered in those days. My second job has been working for the United >> States Department of Agriculture since 1974. Most of this time has been >> using COBOL and a very easy language called Easytrieve which could make >> quick searches of files and then reports. Off and on since 2001 I have > been >> trying to learn Java. Two years ago I went to a new place within > Agriculture >> and my boss has been very supportive. I had the luxury of coding in > NotePad >> which really taught me to put in all the brackets, braces, and parenthesis >> in the right place. Now I am trying to use Eclipse because that is the ide >> of choice. Saying all this is to only say that a basic education will > never >> hurt you. To get a programming position using Java in the United States > will >> need Java certification. In my experience you must make sure you have as >> much education as possible with the highest grades and certification to > get >> a job. Being blind you must prove you are among the best and the brightest >> to find work. I can't imagine learning any of this as a hobby. (grin). >> >> Susie Stanzel >> Programmer U.S.D.A. in Kansas City Missouri >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Homme, James >> Sent: Thursday, July 01, 2010 6:26 AM >> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> Subject: Programming Preferences Was RE: I feel like giving up on >> programming altogether! >> >> Hi, >> With Visual Basic, you can put the statement >> option explicit >> At the beginning of your program, and the compiler will force you to > declare >> variables. >> >> Also, if you get one of the fruit basket programs, you will see how some > of >> the code behind the IDE works. >> >> So your statement about the evils of VB and buttons and controls in an > IDE >> are not completely accurate, but, I agree with you that if you take away >> that part of the learning curve, that it's easier to program when you are >> concentrating on your code. >> >> But I can also see that some of what Rick says is valid. The IDE puts in >> code for you that you'd have to keep a book open to find and learn to use, >> and it knows which files to hook together when you make the various > projects >> and it helps organize your code. That's very convenient, but it doesn't >> teach you how some of the code works. >> >> Ken, I tried to go from Cobol to C++ back in the Borland C++ days, and I >> didn't make it over the hump, so I admire you for learning that language. > I >> felt that no matter how hard I tried, I just wasn't ready to do pointers > and >> learn classes and garbage collection and whatever else that goes with it. >> >> I learned HTML by using FrontPage and NoteTab and letting them generate > the >> code, then seeing it, and realizing that it wasn't that difficult. After >> that, I started doing it by hand. Because I learned to code HTML by hand, > I >> understand it, and I understand what a program that generates it is doing > to >> it. I have the best of both worlds, I can generate some to save time, and > I >> can write some by hand when I want it just right. >> >> So I say that whatever learning style works best for you is just fine, as >> long as you don't talk yourself out of learning. >> >> I kind of started to sneak up on learning about objects by using > LotusScript >> to call methods and get properties of Lotus Notes objects, and I also have >> made several attempts at Python, but so far, I've talked myself out of > going >> the whole way for whatever reason. >> >> I think that we can do whatever we talk ourselves into doing. And I think > we >> can give up just because we tell ourselves that something is too hard. But > I >> think we can trick ourselves into succeeding by just doing the first > thing, >> then the next, then the next, until before we realize it, we've done a big >> thing. >> >> So perhaps the approach would be to learn a language of choice with the > use >> of a text editor, while learning enough about the compiler to understand >> what it's trying to tell you. Then, if you decide to switch over to an > IDE, >> you will understand more of what it's trying to do, and in the long run, >> save yourself some hair pulling. >> >> As far as building forms goes, Jamal has made it a lot easier for all of > us >> to do that with Layout By Code. So those of us, hint to Jim, who say that >> they want to learn a language and do some programming are quickly running >> out of excuses. >> >> We have JAWS and Window-eyes scripts for Visual Studio, and we have a > doable >> environment with a plain old editor, so let's make a pact to just do it. >> >> I'm in. >> >> Jim >> >> Jim Homme, >> Usability Services, >> Phone: 412-544-1810. Skype: jim.homme >> Internal recipients, Read my accessibility blog. Discuss accessibility >> here. Accessibility Wiki: Breaking news and accessibility advice >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf of Alex Midence >> Sent: Thursday, July 01, 2010 12:19 AM >> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >> Subject: Re: I feel like giving up on programming altogether! >> >> Hi, folks, >> >> This thread hit sorta close to home for me. As I have mentioned >> Before, I, myself, am learning how to code and I decided to hop out of >> the proverbial airplane because my language of choice is c++. I began >> with visual studio simply because it was the first compiler and ide I >> found that was easy to get to in google and that was free. I figured >> it'd work best because it was made by the very people who made the >> operating system. I then attempted to apply what I was learning from >> various tutorials in this ide and came to a screeching halt because it >> turns out that this ide doesn't produce "standard c++" unleass you >> tweak it. All the tutorials I was following teach standard c++. I >> then hauled off and got eclipse only to find I needed a compiler to go >> with it. Went and got myself minGw and was still not able to compile >> because I needed to mess with settings in the eclipse ide that I was >> unfamiliar with to let it know where the compiler was and which one to >> use. It wasn't until I just went in and actually wrote my code into a >> no frills text editor (notepad, yes, notepad), saved my file as cpp >> and then compiled in a command line that I got my program to work. I >> learned a whole lot on the way and look forward to learning more. The >> most fundamental lesson I learned was to just work with the raw code >> and command line compiler first before jumping into these ide's. This >> lets me focus on just the language, what it's doing, how it's doig it >> and the act of compiling it. I don't have to worry about a >> potentially inaccessible piece of software cutting into my learning of >> the code. And, it appears I'll get a fuller understanding of what's >> actually going on because I'm doing so much of it by hand. It's like >> making yourself a batch of refried beans starting with the raw beans, >> cooking them in a pot and then frying them afterwards. You did it all >> from scratch instead of just grabbing a can of beans, opening it up >> and heating it up on the stove before serving. Best of all, my >> programs have so far worked like the tutorials said they would. So, >> Jess, my advice to you is this: >> >> Get yourself a nice text editor like edSharp, text pad, ps pad or, >> even notepad which you already have. Then, go get yourself a free >> compiler in the language you choose. I chose c++ because it seems to >> really force you to learn some nuts and bolts and doesn't have the >> feel of some wussy gussied up toy language like visual basic with >> pretty buttons and nice forms and icons and all that mess. It's also >> the language that a huge number of applications are written in which >> leads me to believe that, once I am done learning the basics, I'll be >> able to really do something with it in exchange for all my bloodsweat >> and tears. You choose whatever one you feel you want to though but, >> just stick to the text editor and compiler method for your first >> handful of programs and you'll be better off. Whatever you do, >> though, don't give up over visual studio. >> >> Just my two cents as a fellow neophyte. Hang in there. >> >> Alex >> >> >> On 6/30/10, Tyler Littlefield <tyler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: >>> It won't compile actually, you missed a comma. >>> int main(int argc, char** argv) >>> :) >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Tyler Littlefield >>> http://tds-solutions.net >>> Twitter: sorressean >>> >>> On Jun 30, 2010, at 9:40 PM, Ken Perry wrote: >>> >>>> Um how hard is this >>>> >>>> //myfile.c >>>> #include <stdlib.h> >>>> #include <stdio.h> >>>> Int main (int argc char *arv) >>>> { >>>> Printf ("hello world"); >>>> Return (0); >>>> } >>>> >>>> Gcc myfile.c -o myfile >>>> >>>> There I just wrote a program that will compile in this email. I didn't >>>> need >>>> an ide I didn't need to drop buttons what I could focus on was the code. >>>> The problem is you are confusing learning to code with learning to >> program >>>> applications. Sure I don't want to start my first full blown > application >>>> writing it at the command line creating the graphical widgets etc. I do >>>> how >>>> ever want to start with a simple step by step method. I could write a >>>> simple program to take input in only a couple more lines of code and see >>>> the >>>> results instantly. If I get errors the errors would pop up instantly > you >>>> wouldn't have to hunt for the window they are in. In c variables must > be >>>> at >>>> the top of every code segment or {} section. In languages like VB and >> c++ >>>> and C# you can throw in variable declarations any where. Which is > easier >>>> to >>>> teach someone put your variables here or hey throw them any where and >> then >>>> try and hunt down where the error is? >>>> >>>> I could go on but I have had this argument with professors and at least >>>> held my own if not won from time to time. Its great if all you want to >> do >>>> is make a sited person happy that they made a simple application but if >>>> you >>>> really trying to teach them to code and to continue to learn to code > then >>>> you shouldn't lose them in the manusia before they understand what they >>>> are >>>> doing. >>>> >>>> Now I chalange you to teach me to write a visual basic application in > the >>>> next email you write to this list. Make it write a message to the > screen >>>> and do it from the IDE. See how many steps you have to explain. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ken >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >>>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Jackie >> McBride >>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 30, 2010 11:10 PM >>>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >>>> Subject: Re: I feel like giving up on programming altogether! >>>> >>>> Well, Ken, as I see it, programming is divided into 2 major areas: >>>> 1) Learning to think/problem-solve in the way the computer does; & then >>>> 2) Learning whatever language u need that will fit the sort of >>>> applications you're coding. >>>> >>>> It's a tough road to do both at the same time, & it's why I recommend >>>> learning something easier at first, e.g., basic, Python, etc. Once >>>> folks kind of get the concepts of how to use the compiler/interpreter >>>> & instruct the computer to do what they want, then the next logical >>>> progression is something like C. But I think learning C initially is >>>> rather like what my dad did to me when I was 4--threw me into Lake >>>> Michigan in 62 degree water over my head. Not fun. &, no, it did not >>>> teach me to swim any better or any earlier, believe me. >>>> >>>> In retrospect, I rather like the way I approached things--I taught >>>> myself Basic, which I used (& rather effectively, I might add) to sort >>>> patient visits by date for tax purposes when I was in practice because >>>> my crazy billing program didn't. Then I went on to learn C. It worked >>>> well. That is not to say it will work well for others. Then I got some >>>> formal programming training, & I believe what I'd taught myself >>>> previously stood me in very good stead for learning that. >>>> >>>> Each person has to go his/her own way, I guess, but I think a gentler >>>> intro than C is more beneficial for those who are self-taught. Just my >>>> $.02--& what do I know? You're the 1 making a living at it, not mwa. >>>> >>>> On 6/30/10, Ken Perry <whistler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: >>>>> Actually I know someone who does professional programming who has his >>>> degree >>>>> in electronics and only took two coding classes which he could have >>>>> taught >>>>> when he took hem. College is not all it's cracked up to be but that is >>>>> another argument. >>>>> >>>>> I understand that Jess is using vs but that don't mean he or she has > to. >>>> In >>>>> fact I ended up having to learn the Microsoft build system because the >> VS >>>>> ide wouldn't do the cross compile system I wanted it to so I had to > get >>>> out >>>>> of VS and create the build xml file by hand which you can do. Heck for >>>> that >>>>> matter you can code in VB by hand and actually use a compiler which > gets >>>> you >>>>> out of the graphical IDE and lets you learn to code. In fact you can >>>>> find >>>> a >>>>> few examples of this up on the fruit basket page. >>>>> >>>>> Ken >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >>>>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of RicksPlace >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 30, 2010 10:29 PM >>>>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >>>>> Subject: Re: I feel like giving up on programming altogether! >>>>> >>>>> Hi Ken: Jes said he is working in the VS IDE already. I don't know if > it >>>> is >>>>> for school, for work or just for fun. OK, let me set my point clear... > A >>>>> person needs to get a good University Education in Computer Programming >>>>> or >>>> a >>>>> >>>>> related field to work in that arena. You can not become a Professional >>>>> Programmer by playing with Visual Studio. You can, however, get help on >>>> list >>>>> >>>>> with Visual Studio and it is fine, if you have the patients, for >> learning >>>> to >>>>> >>>>> do some programming as a hobbyist. The things we never talk about to >>>>> nubes >>>>> is the process of learning to turn a step by step analysis of solving >>>>> business, engineering or technical problems into computer code. That is >>>>> where a University Education comes in.. Once that skill is mastered > then >>>> it >>>>> becomes a matter of learning a Programming Language and coding up a >>>>> solution. Using a IDE is just a time saving step after you have done > the >>>>> former learning processes. When I see someone asking to learn to become >> a >>>>> Computer Programmer by reading books and learning on their own I assume >>>> they >>>>> >>>>> are trying to do it as a hobby. I can't imagine anyone in their right >>>>> mind >>>>> would seriously consider trying to learn to become a Professional >>>>> Computer >>>>> Programmer and compete in the Job Market without a formal education - > it >>>>> just seems like so much nonsense. There might be one or two out there >> who >>>>> did it that way but 99+ percent have taken University Courses if they >>>>> work >>>>> in the field. Jes said he was working on a project in VS IDE, having >>>>> problems and the process I outlined just touched bases with the things >> he >>>>> needed to ensure he did, and did correctly, to get his project up and >>>>> running. The blurb about learning Programming ie... IPO, was just to >>>>> start >>>>> the brain working in thinking about inputs, outputs and Processing as 3 >>>>> things that need to be done, sigh, and even that is diferent in today's >>>> OOP >>>>> world. >>>>> Rick USA. >>>>> Message ----- >>>>> From: "Ken Perry" <whistler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> >>>>> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 30, 2010 9:47 PM >>>>> Subject: RE: I feel like giving up on programming altogether! >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I am sorry Rick but this is what is wrong with most coders coming out >> of >>>>>> college now days. They code by the drop button and create if > statement >>>>>> method. Have you actually looked at Job listings. A person that >> learns >>>>>> to >>>>>> code the way you just laid out whether they be sited or blind will be >>>>>> the >>>>>> bottom of the barrel. Some jobs asks for Visual studio but a monkey >> can >>>>>> make a form and add an if statement to it to make a button do >> something. >>>>>> If >>>>>> a person wants to be a coder they need to be make sure they are not >>>>>> getting >>>>>> themselves where they can be put out by some new AI programming >> language >>>>>> that can make the forms straight from a design chart created by a >>>>>> secretary. That type of coding can be done by anyone. >>>>>> >>>>>> Colleges switched to GUI environments to make money because any sited >>>>>> person >>>>>> can create a half baked program with them. They did the same thing to >>>> the >>>>>> electronics field with places like ITT and other tech schools that >>>>>> taught >>>>>> half baked electronics. Now I am not saying a good electronics person >>>>>> or >>>>>> a >>>>>> good coder can't come from the easy road what I am saying is it is > much >>>>>> more >>>>>> unlikely that one will. >>>>>> >>>>>> If on the other hand you start with a compiled language or an > assembled >>>>>> language you will understand what is going on. You shouldn't even >> worry >>>>>> about the GUI till you know how programs are logically put together > and >>>>>> why. >>>>>> Otherwise we are going to need that 48 core computer and 12 TB of ram >>>> just >>>>>> to run the next text editor because we as coders are getting > slipperier >>>>>> and >>>>>> messier because we don't understand what is going on under the engine. >>>>>> >>>>>> Anyway I have ranted enough but a person that is just getting started >>>>>> would >>>>>> be better to start in straight C and learn what memory was, how to > deal >>>>>> with >>>>>> pointers, and understand what a register is because in the long run if >>>>>> you're really going to be a coder not a monkey dialog maker you will >>>>>> need >>>>>> that information and if you think you have become a coder by creating >>>> some >>>>>> monkey dialogs you will find yourself very screwed when you take that >>>>>> job >>>>>> you are not even close to ready for. >>>>>> >>>>>> Ken >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >>>>>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of RicksPlace >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 30, 2010 9:18 PM >>>>>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >>>>>> Subject: Re: I feel like giving up on programming altogether! >>>>>> >>>>>> First, Programming in today's world is a world apart from where we use >>>>>> to >>>>>> be. It is so much simpler in some ways and light years more complex in >>>>>> other >>>>>> >>>>>> ways. Programming in the Visual Studio IDE takes a large learning >> curve. >>>>>> You >>>>>> >>>>>> need to install and configure that puppy. Fail to do this and you > will >>>> be >>>>>> hearing more junk and losing focus more than an intrevert at a rock >>>>>> concert. >>>>>> >>>>>> That is a pain itself. Then, if you run JAWS you need to configure >> JAWS, >>>>>> again better get it right. Then after you get all that done you can >> open >>>>>> the >>>>>> >>>>>> IDE and look at a bunch of buttons and dialogs that have seemingly >>>> nothing >>>>>> to do with creating a computer program using computer statements. And, >>>> God >>>>>> Forbid, You try and download and install Sql Server Express, well, you >>>>>> will >>>>>> be headed for gray hair if you are one of the lucky few who get that >>>>>> far. >>>>>> You absolutely need to configure the IDE for accessibility, pick the >>>>>> ssimpelest language, vb.net, to start with and create your first Hello >>>>>> World >>>>>> >>>>>> Form from the Form1 file. That is after you create a new project of > the >>>>>> Windows Forms type. Then you can drop a couple of buttons, a textbox > or >>>>>> 2 >>>>>> on >>>>>> >>>>>> the Form1 designer, set their properties and code the related VB Code >>>>>> for >>>>>> the Button Click Events and mess with the Text Properties of the >>>>>> TextBoxes. >>>>>> If you get that far you will be on your way to learning to Program in >>>>>> Visual >>>>>> >>>>>> Studio. I would start with the Vb.net Express module since it does not >>>>>> have >>>>>> all the other languages and is just a little cleaner to start with. >> Once >>>>>> you >>>>>> >>>>>> get the nack of making a form do things like Display Output to a user, >>>>>> Read >>>>>> Inputs from a user and do some Processing on the input, you have the >>>> basic >>>>>> understanding of what computer programming is really about IPO, Input > / >>>>>> Process / Output. If you jump into C++, Visual Studio IDE and a DB you >>>> are >>>>>> jumping out of an airplane and flapping as hard as you can but you can >>>>>> pretty much guess the final result. But, Give Up? Did We Give Up when >>>>>> the >>>>>> Germans Bombed Pearl Harbor? No, when the going gets tough - the tough >>>> ask >>>>>> questions on list and follow up with more work! >>>>>> Rick USA >>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>> From: "Jes" <theeternalkid@xxxxxxxxx> >>>>>> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 30, 2010 1:59 PM >>>>>> Subject: I feel like giving up on programming altogether! >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi all, >>>>>> >>>>>> All I get when using visual studio are nothing but errors! I just want >>>>>> to >>>>>> be >>>>>> >>>>>> able to write a program and have it work! Just once! But no. All I get >>>> are >>>>>> errors! So what's the use in even trying? Encouragement needed badly! >>>>>> Thanks. >>>>>> Jes >>>>>> >>>>>> __________ >>>>>> View the list's information and change your settings at >>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind >>>>>> >>>>>> __________ >>>>>> View the list's information and change your settings at >>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind >>>>>> >>>>>> __________ >>>>>> View the list's information and change your settings at >>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> __________ >>>>> View the list's information and change your settings at >>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind >>>>> >>>>> __________ >>>>> View the list's information and change your settings at >>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Change the world--1 deed at a time >>>> Jackie McBride >>>> Scripting Classes: http://jawsscripting.lonsdalemedia.org >>>> homePage: www.abletec.serverheaven.net >>>> For technophobes: www.technophoeb.com >>>> __________ >>>> View the list's information and change your settings at >>>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind >>>> >>>> __________ >>>> View the list's information and change your settings at >>>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind >>>> >>> >>> __________ >>> View the list's information and change your settings at >>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind >>> >>> >> __________ >> View the list's information and change your settings at >> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind >> >> >> This e-mail and any attachments to it are confidential and are intended >> solely for use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. 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The views expressed in this e-mail message do not >> necessarily represent the views of Highmark Inc., its subsidiaries, or >> affiliates. >> __________ >> View the list's information and change your settings at >> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind >> >> __________ >> View the list's information and change your settings at >> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind >> >> __________ >> View the list's information and change your settings at >> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind >> >> __________ >> View the list's information and change your settings at >> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind >> >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >> Version: 8.5.439 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2973 - Release Date: 06/30/10 >> 18:38:00 >> >> __________ >> View the list's information and change your settings at >> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind >> >> >> __________ >> View the list's information and change your settings at >> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind >> >> __________ >> View the list's information and change your settings at >> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind >> > > __________ > View the list's information and change your settings at > //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind > > > __________ > View the list's information and change your settings at > //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind > > -- Change the world--1 deed at a time Jackie McBride Scripting Classes: http://jawsscripting.lonsdalemedia.org homePage: www.abletec.serverheaven.net For technophobes: www.technophoeb.com __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind