[opendtv] Re: AVSForum getting antsy over 8-VSB reception
- From: Cliff Benham <cbenham@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: opendtv@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 21:10:03 -0500
Why would networks bear the cost of O&O OTA broadcast facilities when
they can cover their viewers with satellite and cable?
They would still have a local studio and do news but they wouldn't have
to pay for all the power and upkeep of the stick.
If, in 10 years, 99.5% of the Philadelphia viewers can get all the DTV
'network channels' over cable and satellite why would the broadcasters
continue to pay for maintenance and power for a 1500 ft tower and
transmitters? It doesn't make economic sense if you consider the
power costs alone.
Tom Barry wrote:
>I don't think OTA is going away. But it seems possible the non-O&O
>stations may all fail. They sort of are caught in a squeeze between the
>network content owners and the need to be carried on cable. So if OTA
>is not feasible and the networks gradually offer affiliates less and
>less attractive terms I'm not sure what sort of bargaining position the
>NAB members can maintain.
>
>As Craig says, it is probably just ownership caps that keep them alive.
>
>Eventually the networks or other associated Hollywood entities will
>probably acquire them somehow and we can then change to a new model of
>some sort. At that time we will probably come up with some new
>broadcast standard, either as another transition or by high-ish
>definition mobile video gradually winning a competitive war.
>
>Meanwhile the independents will bleed and we will all continue to wonder
>what is going on, with so many apparently inexplicable decisions by the
>power players.
>
>- Tom
>
>
>
>Cliff Benham wrote
>
>
>
>>Why bother? What's really happening is that over the air broadcasting=20
>>is going to be gone in 10 years or so. Why else would the FCC chose a
>>system that doesn't work? Look at what is happening. Cable and satellite
>>supply television to 85% of the homes in the US right now. The Networks
>>have abandoned the NAB and these pages carry stories of new technical =
>>means=20
>>of bringing TV into homes without over the air broadcasters being =
>>involved.
>>What other conclusion is there to draw? Over The Air is going away.
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: opendtv-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>[mailto:opendtv-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Mark Aitken
>>Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2005 2:21 PM
>>To: opendtv@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>Subject: [opendtv] Re: AVSForum getting antsy over 8-VSB reception
>>
>>
>>I would be glad to sit down and discuss/entertain/dream about various=20
>>options. I will be spending time in LV after the show...name the=20
>>time/place and I'll be there. I am convinced that the only avenue that=20
>>could possibly change the present course/situation is through Congress.
>>The question of whether we SHOULD (or not) meet...well, that is another=20
>>matter...:-) Open for discussion.
>>
>>Stephen W. Long wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>Another question: How do you get ATSC reception when you are hiding in
>>>your basement riding out a hurricane or tornado or HLS event? My =
>>>
>>>
>>analog
>>
>>
>>
>>>NTSC signal in my basement using rabbit ears is snowy but can be =
>>>
>>>
>>received,
>>
>>
>>
>>>and my family spent a long evening watching the local news and weather
>>>while a tornado went skipping through Northern Virginia last year. =
>>>
>>>
>>There
>>
>>
>>
>>>is no ATSC reception at all in my basement (that my 2nd generation box
>>>could see - no channel reception at all).
>>>
>>>I argued back in 98 or so that reliance on a roof mounted antenna =
>>>
>>>
>>during
>>
>>
>>
>>>bad weather events was not a good plan for the nation.
>>>
>>>My points are still valid - no one from ATSC has EVER provided a =
>>>
>>>
>>reasonable
>>
>>
>>
>>>suggestion as to how 8VSB would handle emergency condition broadcasts.
>>>Their answer then (and now I believe) was to use 2VSB. Well, ok, how =
>>>
>>>
>>many
>>
>>
>>
>>>of the legacy 8VSB systems out there will do 2VSB? None that I have =
>>>
>>>
>>ever
>>
>>
>>
>>>read about. How many transmitters (exciters) are ready to do 2VSB? =
>>>
>>>
>>Not
>>
>>
>>
>>>many I'll wager.
>>>
>>>The most fascinating lie I am anticipating receiving is the argument =
>>>
>>>
>>that
>>
>>
>>
>>>it will be ok to disenfranchise all of the existing receivers to give =
>>>
>>>
>>all
>>
>>
>>
>>>new receivers the ability to also receive 2VSB, have the broadcast =
>>>
>>>
>>flag,
>>
>>
>>
>>>etc. The lie will be that it will be ok to change to support changes =
>>>
>>>
>>in
>>
>>
>>
>>>the ATSC spec and require new receivers, but not entertain a change to
>>>COFDM because it will disenfranchise the existing receivers.
>>>
>>>The roll out of ATSC receivers has been so poor that there may actually =
>>>
>>>
>>be
>>
>>
>>
>>>an opportunity next year to propose a new system, using the more robust
>>>versions of COFDM coming out of Japan, etc., using H.264 for =
>>>
>>>
>>compression,
>>
>>
>>
>>>native IP support, etc. To add even more fuel to the fire, we could =
>>>
>>>
>>find a
>>
>>
>>
>>>way to specify HDTV using H.264 using less than 6MHz RF channels. =
>>>
>>>
>>Wouldn't
>>
>>
>>
>>>THAT cause some stir. We could double/triple the number of over the =
>>>
>>>
>>air
>>
>>
>>
>>>channels, not to mention the ability to shut down all non-SFN repeaters
>>>that use up so many of the high UHF channels today.
>>>
>>>Should a group of us meet at the end of NAB, spend a long weekend =
>>>
>>>
>>writing a
>>
>>
>>
>>>new US DTV specification, and submit it to CONGRESS (not the #$%^&* FCC
>>>staff that got us into this mess)?
>>>
>>>At 07:59 AM 2/23/2005 -0500, you wrote:
>>>=20
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>He was technically correct because ATSC was designed for directional=20
>>>>rooftop antennas. That was an incredibly stupid decision but =
>>>>
>>>>
>>supposedly=20
>>
>>
>>
>>>>true.
>>>>
>>>>I would love for Congress to actually pin down everybody involved as =
>>>>
>>>>
>>to=20
>>
>>
>>
>>>>whether they actually believe the digital transition can complete=20
>>>>without economical and functional indoor set top antenna reception.
>>>>
>>>>- Tom
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Bob Miller wrote:
>>>>
>>>> =20
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Some are complaining that we need those 5th gen receivers now and=20
>>>>>bringing up old 8-VSB performance data, recently a big NO NO.
>>>>>
>>>>>In answer to CKNA on AVSForum dirk1843 puts it best....
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> =20
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=3Dc1d8d3905cfcbb1352091a=
>>>
>>>
>>337d47
>>
>>
>>
>>>9339&threadid=3D496065
>>>=20
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>"I think most of the problem, is as CKNA said, poor antenna install =
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>or=20
>>
>>
>>
>>>>>wrong type for area."
>>>>>
>>>>>What can I say, now I understand, 8-VSB was designed for the right =
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>type=20
>>
>>
>>
>>>>>of area and some of us just happen to live in a "wrong type of area".
>>>>>
>>>>>Now it all makes sense.
>>>>>
>>>>>Bob Miller
>>>>>=20
>>>>>=20
>>>>>----------------------------------------------------------------------=
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>
>>
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>>--=20
>>
>>Regards,
>>Mark A. Aitken Director, Advanced Technology
>>
>>***********************************
>>Sinclair Broadcast Group
>>10706 Beaver Dam Road
>>Hunt Valley, MD 21030
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