In a message dated 4/20/2009 3:43:53 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, donalmcevoyuk@xxxxxxxxxxx writes: Still don't quite understand what TLP means when it asserts a 'proposition is a fact' (rather than is _of_ a fact)? Perhaps someone might explain. ----- Well, perhaps Wittgenstein wasn't too serious on his classical background. Ditto his brother. His harmonies many regard now as 'simple'. In Latin, from the Greek, pro-positio is an _act_ of 'ponere', to put. positio is the noun formed out of the preterite form. The Greek exact equivalent is 'thesis'. Now, 'pro' in Greek would come out as meta-thesis? Then there's pre-positio -- ad - positio sub- positio pre -- sub -- positio etc. Whereas 'fact' is slightly abused in Latin. It is indeed from 'facere', to make. As in 'orifice', to make a mouth or hole. So, that the sun rises from the east is not a _fact_ (unless you are a silly deist). It's not a pro-positio either. You _pro-pose_ when you _say_ it. Cheers, JL **************Access 350+ FREE radio stations anytime from anywhere on the web. Get the Radio Toolbar! (http://toolbar.aol.com/aolradio/download.html?ncid=emlcntusdown00000003) ------------------------------------------------------------------ To change your Lit-Ideas settings (subscribe/unsub, vacation on/off, digest on/off), visit www.andreas.com/faq-lit-ideas.html