Dear Ed and all,
I respect your professional opinion and I think the key word in your note is
*diagnosed*. There is such a drive to catalog and pigeonhole a patient that
I believe there are numerous cases of misdiagnosis because the presenting
symptoms approximate a given condition. I also think that the terms cure and
heal are used unconsciously. The first definition of *cure* is: relieve (a
person or animal) of the symptoms of a disease or condition and allopathic
medicine does just that. It relieves the symptoms with either drugs or
surgery but it quite seldom deals with the cause of the condition in the
first place. *Heal* is defined as: cause (a wound, injury, or person) to
become sound or healthy again. I am certain that with your vast experience
in this work that you have experienced this with people who have been
subjects of a constellation you have facilitated.
So, I ask you to consider that healing does occur from this work. To what
degree is obviously subjective. From what I have read in earlier posts by
Moira, Marta, Carolyn,Dee and my own personal experience the person
diagnosed with this condition has shown improvement varying from moderate to
significant. I can say that the young man I represented is as normal as any
of us can get. I interact with him on a frequent basis and our professional
relationship is that of a life coach not a therapist. This person does not
manifest any of the classical symptoms of schizophrenia as i know them.
What I am learning and trust I will continue to deepen my understanding is
that there is an element of "magic" in this work. There is something that I
can not explain when you reorder the heirachy in a family and the diagnosed
symptoms in two distinct cases of lupus disappear; or persistent headaches
terminate at the end of a constellation and eleven days later in a brain
scan the tumor which was nominated as the cause of the severe headaches is
no longer detectable. I call these healings. As a consequence, I work from
the premise that anything is possible with this work. And I am not naive to
think that it is a panacea for all that ails the human race or our beloved
planet. I do believe that any subject that experiences an ecologically
facilitated constellation will be a different person better suited to find
their true self following participation in a constellation.
Fondly,
Stephen
On Mon, Jul 12, 2010 at 16:33, ed lynch <breakers2@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Dear All,
I seriously doubt that systemic constellations heal or cure a clearly
diagnosed schizophrenia
Ed Lynch
On Mon, Jul 12, 2010 at 1:13 PM,
<jprincipe@xxxxxxxxxx<jprincipe%40cyo.com.pe>>
wrote:
Dear all:heard
I'm agree with Carloyn about the care we must to keep in mind (and soul)
working with "mental diseases".
Sometime -in the middle of my training to become a Facilitator- I've
a very experienced Facilitator from Argentina something like: "Hellingerhe
comes and choose a person with schizophrenia because he is Hellinger and
can do it; but when the seminar ends, we have to deal with comsequencesin
the system of pacients without family support"and
Warmly,
Julio
Enviado desde mi BlackBerry de Movistar
-----Original Message-----
From: "Carolyn Zahner" <cpzahner@xxxxxxxxxxxx <cpzahner%40cinci.rr.com>>
Sender:
ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<ConstellationTalk%40yahoogroups.com>
Date: Sun, 11 Jul 2010 14:00:25
To: <ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<ConstellationTalk%40yahoogroups.com>
Reply-To:
ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<ConstellationTalk%40yahoogroups.com>
Subject: Re: [ConstellationTalk] Constellations and schizophrenia.
Dear Galina et all,
Thank you for this thread. I am very grateful to the many teachers on CT.
I am a psychotherapist from Cincinnati, Ohio, USA. I have worked with
people displaying psychotic features (hallucinations and/or delusions)
their families for 30 years. I have always worked from a systemicapproach
and have been applying Systemic Constellation Work (individual and group)to
my work for about 7 years. I am very careful about whether or not I allowto
the psychotic individual to participate in a group. I only allow
participation if the person is exhibiting strong organized thought and is
well grounded in consensus reality at the time. Additionally, they have
have strong family support and safety. The family members must beinvolved
and understand the process.was
I have been working with a family (father, mother, daughter) for 4 years.
At the time I became involved, both the 72 year old mother, and the 49
years old daughter were severely mentally ill. Both were drugged into
non-functional stupor in efforts to hold their hallucinations at bay. The
mother had just recently been hospitalized. The 74 father, the total
caretaker of both his wife and daughter, was ready to collapse.
Over the past 4 years, they have attended a group where a constellation
set up for them. Another time, per their request, we did a constellationin
group on their behalf (they were not present). I also had the opportunityto
take their case into supervision at Bernreid '06. Profound movement hasthe
occurred following each piece of work. I have also used constellation in
individual setting, most often with mother and father together anddaughter
individually. The group work and the individual work continually informand
unfold in a complementary and progressive manner.moved
Both mother and daughter have made extraordinary improvements. They are
now on very little medication. The 53 year old daughter has recently
out of her parents' home for the first time, is holding a full time joband
participating in a CET (cognitive enhancement therapy) program to "wakeup"
her mental functioning again. The 76 year old mother is taking artclasses
and even showing and selling her work, as well as, taking Thai Chi. BothEntering
are doing extremely well. The father has also manifested extreme change
regarding his participation in this system.
I experience Constellations as one way to offer a space in which the
alternative reality of the psychotic individual can find its place and
meaning within the consensus reality of the family (and culture).
a space where all realities are able to exist can result in a family soulto
giving its permission for movement to ease the suffering. From a systemic
approach, I ask:
1. How are the psychotic features trying to aid the individual and the
system to which s/he belongs?
2. How can the individual and/or family move to allow the manifestations
be experienced in different form, integrated and/or released?members.
Like dreams, we can find the wisdom in the images and experiences within
the alternate reality of the psychotic experience and how they connect to
the consensus reality of the family/culture.
As in all approaches, including Constellation Work, the deeper wisdom and
process of the individual and the family soul determines how much, if any
"improvement" occurs. From what I have experienced, Constellations can be
an invaluable tool in restoring healthful functioning to the psycchotic
individual and/or increasing peace and understanding for the family
it
Best Regards,
Carolyn Zahner
Carolyn Zahner, MSW, LISW, Inc
513-697-0260
www.carolynzahner.com
11223 Cornell Park Drive, Suite 402
Cincinnati, Ohio 45242
----- Original Message -----
From: ion bucur
To: ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<ConstellationTalk%40yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, July 11, 2010 3:02 AM
Subject: Re: [ConstellationTalk] Constellations and schizophrenia.
Hi Galina,
I have participated to several workshops where a schizophrenic mother(50
years old) and her sun were participating too. After two workshops no
improvement were evident, except the fact that after the first time, when
she could not do any work at all, was very closed, in the second was
designated to represent somebody s wife. In the constellation and after
she behave like a schizophrenic, without being able to make distinctionsun
between contellation and the real situation, between her and her role. It
seemed that the things got worse.
But, after the third workshop, which lasted one week, and involved her
and her daughter in law, the very spectacular improvement appeared. Sheher
became communicative, open and for the first time after one year she was
smiling and she was adequate. For the people that had known her, and knew
how is schizophrenia perceived in psychiatry, this was like a miracle.
What happened in that workshop? When she worked, the facilitator asked
to choose 15 participants to represent her ancestors(She did not knowsomething
anything about a murder or something like that in her family. If
occured it was totaly covered, secret). She asked her ancestors for help,wrote:
honoured them, and some of them react very clear and strong.
In that night we saw her for the first time smiling, and we experience a
strong feeling of humble.
When I remember that I feel the same, I feel humbling.
Ion Bucur
Consultant
Signum Artis
--- On Sat, 7/10/10, Stephen Campbell
<coachuno@xxxxxxxxx<coachuno%40gmail.com>>
reported
From: Stephen Campbell <coachuno@xxxxxxxxx <coachuno%40gmail.com>>
Subject: Re: [ConstellationTalk] Constellations and schizophrenia.
To: ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<ConstellationTalk%40yahoogroups.com>
Date: Saturday, July 10, 2010, 1:37 AM
Galina,
I have worked and participated in constellations involving schizophrenia.
One of the most memorable was one in which I represented the young
schizophrenic. Several months later I ran into his mother and she
significant improvement. A little over a year and half after thethe
Constellation a young man called to make an appointment with me. When we
met
in my offices and in the brief interview I realized this was the young
man
that I had represented and I can report that he has no vestiges of the
condition. I am not a psychiatrist; but, I have had considerable
experience
working with mental conditions and working with him on life and work
issues
I am clear that his current behaviors are not that of a schizophrenic. He
subsequently mentioned that he has gotten a clean bill of health from
licensed professionals.
Having facilitated several constellations involving schizophrenics what I
have learned is that the schizophrenic is entangled with a murder that
occurred between 4-7 generations back and the schizophrenic represents
two excluded persons: the perpetrator and the victim.working
Trust this information is of use to you.
Fondly,
Stephen
STEPHEN CAMPBELL
SYSTEMIC CONSTELLATION FACILITATOR / CONSTELADOR SISTÉMICO
MA, R.SC.P., MPNLP (HEALTH), ND (CANDIDATE)
904.430.0248
213-985-2368
51.1.447.6652
51.1.995.512.315
COACHUNO@xxxxxxxxx <COACHUNO%40GMAIL.COM>
SKYPE: ELCOACHUNO
On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 10:33, Galina Thomas
<galinat@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx<galinat%40dslextreme.com>
wrote:
Hi, everybody,
I have a question about schizophrenia. Has anyone had experience
with schizophrenia (especially not directly with a patient, but his/her
relatives). Are there known cases of improvement as a result of
Constellations?
Thank you for any information!
Galina Thomas
MFT Trainee, Los Angeles, California
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