I should have posted the tiny article on Chomsky's view of Sanders which is
that his role is a positive one in that he is educating the public about
economic issues and moving the Democratic Party slightly to the left on
those issues and that, of course, he won't win the nomination. And that if
he won, he would not be permitted to make meaningful change. Chomsky really
sounded like you, and me. But when we talk about pushing people to the
left, what that really means is we get them to say what we want them to say.
They say it so we will vote for them. But the point is, and it was my point
in 2012 and it was your point in your last post, that electing one of the
Republicans as President, would be a complete and utter disaster. Reagan
caused terrible changes in our political and economic system which have
never gone away. True, Clinton did bad things, but they were enabled by
Reagan's changes. And it was Bush who got us into Iraq, the War on Terror,
and everything that followed. Obama walked into a situation that was
pre-ordained. With the gerymandering, we may continue to have Republican
majorities in the House and Senate, and if we have a Republican
administration, medicare and social security really will be privatized.
Medicaid and abortion truly will be ended. Federal programs will be
demolished. And we'll be declaring war on Iran, Syria, and perhaps, soon
enough, Russia.
Miriam
-----Original Message-----
From: blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Carl Jarvis
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2015 5:09 PM
To: blind-democracy@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [blind-democracy] Re: Republican Assault on Trump May Only Make Him
Stronger
Miriam,
Ya got me! But I've never claimed to be consistent. I figured at some
point you would remind me of my own words. But I'm not running for office.
Still, I only said that Hillary Clinton could be leaned on to hold the line
on some of the services and programs that are important to the working men
and women. That is, in the rather likely event that Bernie Sanders loses
the nomination.
And yes, I was frustrated enough with Barak Obama that I voted for Jill
Stein in 2012, and I very well might do so again in 2016. But I waffle.
And I don't feel that my waffling makes any difference. The presidential
election is so contrived that no matter who we are allowed to choose
between, we are supporting the Empire's agenda. So keeping my eye on the
long range goal of developing a platform for a People's World Party, I could
vote for Clinton if she were looking like she might be pressured into
defending social programs.
After all, Barak Obama has done far less harm to working class Americans
than would any of his opponents. But still, I really don't want to vote for
a man who has eight years of presiding over world-wide murder, and not
speaking out against our eternal war policy. And now that we're on the
subject, maybe I should rethink my support for Sanders. After all, Sanders
has not made any serious attempt to end the Empire's wanton killing. And in
fact, he has voted "Aye" on many of the worst military spending bills.
The good thing about spending half the president's second term deciding on
his replacement is that we have lots of time to change our minds many times
over.
Carl Jarvis
On 8/11/15, Miriam Vieni <miriamvieni@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Carl,the same things.
You're sounding different than you did in 2012. You could vote for
Clinton as opposed to the Republican candidates? But four years ago
you could not vote for Obama as opposed to Romney. Do you think that
these guys are worse than he was? Romney and Ryan were promising precisely
Clinton will do precisely what Obama is doing, only with morebragging rights.
cooperation, if possible, with Israel and the Neo Cons.
Miriam
-----Original Message-----
From: blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:blind-democracy-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Carl Jarvis
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2015 11:18 AM
To: blind-democracy@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [blind-democracy] Re: Republican Assault on Trump May Only
Make Him Stronger
Well Bob, the news isn't all that positive regarding us working stiffs
getting together. We've been misdirected for so long, and I suspect
we also enjoy squabbling, so that we are in a long, long learning
curve. But I notice more and more people figuring it out. Still, we
have situations like the women who disrupted Sanders in Seattle, who
are so self-focused that they simply have to make their point as they
drive wedges. We'll see if Sanders has the ability to spin such
divisiveness to his advantage. Have you noticed that Hillary Clinton
is sounding more like Bernie Sanders?
Anyway, it's all smoke and mirrors until we see some real tangible proof.
Still, the problem goes far beyond the good old U. S. of A. Every
nation sees itself as better than all other nations. Because the
American Empire is the big bully on the block, we get to have the loudest
How do we ever get to the place where all people see all people as
worthy of respect? How do we look past the window dressing each of
us, and each nation has put in place, and get to the real people?
The prospects are slim to grim, and at best the solutions are way down
the road. So whatever we do today should be with the understanding
that it is an effort toward a temporary fix. I can support Bernie
Sanders, knowing that he is not going to bring us into a new age, just
so long as I continue working for that dream of One People, One Earth
goal. Hell, I could even vote for Hillary if it came down to Clinton
versus any one of the Top Ten RepubliClowns. Sure, she would continue
to strong arm the rest of the world, bend the rules for the Corporate
Citizens, and make meaningless mouthings to the Working Class, but
with enough pressure we could hold a few lines. That is something we
could not do with the gang from the other side of the aisle. But
still, it is all with the understanding that no matter what we do, the
current Empire, and the Empires around the globe who are also
jockeying for dominance, must eventually be disposed and replaced with
a world-wide, one people nation. What that will look like will depend
upon the farsightedness of those future planners and designers.
Carl Jarvis
On 8/11/15, Bob Hachey <bhachey@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Hey Carl,
Very well said as to how groups at the bottom tend to fight each
other when they should be unified against the ruling class. That is
exactly what the ruling class wants. Notice how the media often
focuses on the horse races of pols and the times when those at the
bottom fight each other. I must agree that much of it is a show
designed to keep us down and to keep us fighting eachd other.
So, the quessstion is how do we who are oppressed rise above the very
human tendency to keep on doing what we've been doing and fight each
other. It has been said that insanity is continuing to act in a
certain whay when it has proven to be unsuccessful. Until and unless
we who are oppressed, the poor, African-Americans, Asians, Hispanics,
Gays and persons with disabilities can learn to put our differences
aside and focus on the bigger picture, things wil not improve.
Bob Hachey
