--- In Wittrs@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, Justintruth <wittrsamr@...> wrote: words I wished I'd had penned. You help me see why and how I go inc circles with SWM. You recommend: > First: Whenever you say that consciousness is physical, or something > like that, say something like "physical only in the sense that it is > caused by something material, but in what sense can something material cause that which is not material? As you point out... > No one yet has a precise description of the mechanism... which makes it sound as if we were only asking what brain part is associated with C, the computer analogy and such, when I think we are asking whether it is intelligible at all to ask how something material causes that which isn't. > Third: Abandon the wheel moving analogy as it is misleading. Right! Because... > consciousness is not just a function of the configuration of the objects > but is the "experiential phenomena of subjects" which is to say (at least to me) there is no material relationship between brain and experience. I've repeatedly suggested that the relationship is internal. What we mean by "a living brain" is one associated with a conscious person what we mean by "consciousness" is that which we achieve with a "living brain." bruce ========================================= Need Something? Check here: http://ludwig.squarespace.com/wittrslinks/