[SI-LIST] Re: fiber-weave effect alive and well?
- From: "Loyer, Jeff" <jeff.loyer@xxxxxxxxx>
- To: <gedlund@xxxxxxxxxx>, <si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Thu, 30 Aug 2007 15:03:48 -0700
Some work that we've done is available at
http://www.circuitree.com/CDA/Articles/Web_Only_Editorial/BNP_GUID_9-5-2
006_A_10000000000000063250
But, this is the same paper as was presented in DesignCon '07, and the
performance hit is evaluated with simulations (though the delta Er value
used in the simulations is derived from empirical data).
If you're asking about measurements of actual systems, I don't think
anyone's done that. The applicability of the data would be so narrow
(only relevant for those specific weave type/dimensions, weave alignment
of the signal layers on that particular build of boards, etc.) as to be
virtually meaningless.
Jeff Loyer
-----Original Message-----
From: si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Gregory R Edlund
Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2007 1:53 PM
To: si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [SI-LIST] fiber-weave effect alive and well?
I would be interested in reading a paper that demonstrates measured
jitter=20
hit from fiber weave, i.e. apples-to-apples comparison for a specific=20
application with and without the fiber-trace alignment.
Anyone have a good reference?
Greg Edlund
Senior Engineer
Signal Integrity
IBM Global Engineering Solutions
3605 Hwy. 52 N, Dept. HDC
Rochester, MN 55901
gedlund@xxxxxxxxxx
> [Original Message]
> From: agathon <hreidmarkailen@xxxxxxxxx>
> To: si-list <si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Date: 8/29/2007 5:47:36 PM
> Subject: [SI-LIST] fiber-weave effect alive and well?
>
> * I've reviewed DesignCon 05,07 material on fiber-weave effect.
> * A 10G (802.3ap) PHY vendor claims their demo setup used FR408 (Dk/Df
=3D
> 3.77/0.012) for backplane sections and a total channel of 1meter.
> * FR408, as far as I know, still has the basic weave/resin
construction,
> though perhaps less Dk delta.
>
>
> Q:
> 1. Huh? What happened? Did the PHY vendor call in the wizard kids
from
> Hogworts? What is the current reality?
> 2. Any knowledge of Rogers4350? Ie: a different construction? Weave
> effect?
> 3. Up to date publications on this? (Besides references in the above=20
DCon
> material.)
>
> Also, I see no mention of the weave effect on authoritative things
from
> 802.3ap people on commsdesign or elsewhere, from 2004 on.
>
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