[ SHOWGSD-L ] Re: IS THE GSDCA TOO DESPERATE?LONG SORRY
- From: PlushPuppyOhio <plushpuppyohio@xxxxxxxxx>
- To: hckryhillgsd@xxxxxxxxxxxxx, showgsd-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 13:20:27 -0700 (PDT)
ok. I havent explained myself well, and I've had some adjustments to my
thoughts too... and I will admit I took offense at your inital response to me.
All that aside... these are my thoughts.
I generally am in support of those willing to do things, and I absolutely
commend that. Just recently I myself have been trying to brainstorm ideas to
get Juniors involved. If I wasnt willing to put myself on the line, I wouldnt
respond to posts and voice my concerns/thoughts. I realize though nothing is
an easy task... so I certainly never meant to add negativity to this.
Bottom line. A list, that YOU create and only let GSDCA member join... I think
is a GREAT idea. It would give us all a place to talk with other members,
without outside input. While I do think it is important we consider the
thoughts of others, to have one place where its just memebers, would be nice.
HOWEVER, I don't think it should be something the PC creates. TO ME, that is
opening a can of worms. If a topic is brought up on the "Official PC Email
List", will some members see that and think, oh my god, the parent club is
talking about this, or thinks this, or thinks that? When in reality, the Board
might not have even had a chance to comment. There is no way for the Board to
address and respond to every issue. Its one thing to officially discuss PC
matters at a designated time and place where all members can participate if
they want, and the board can discuss its views. Its nother to have official
conversations on an open email list, that can chat whenever they want, any time
day or night, any day of the week.
Does that make sense? I think an email list that the..... Membership
Committee for example (I just had a thought) is responsible for is a good
idea. I just think it needs to be clear it is the memberships discussion, not
the Boards. And when you talk about the Parent Club and its decisions, people
think the Board. Its certainly a venue Board members could comment on, or
join freely too.... it just wouldnt be representative of the Board itself.
Otherwise, crazy conversations will indefinitely take place, and
miss-interpretations will be rampant.
Does that make sense? Do you see what I mean by a list being a good idea, but
the perception of who is controlling it, or what the title of that list is, is
a big issue to me.
Sean
Steve Grainger <hckryhillgsd@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
The problem with e-mail is that you can't see or hear who you are
addressing. You are correct..you had better believe I thought things out
before I posted the suggestions to the List..I would of course be
passionate about what I believe. I went out on a limb to offer suggestions
for improvement..did you? Are you willing to "go for it.." by putting
yourself on the line..run the risk of offending some for what you believe
could benefit the club long term? I have voluntarily put myself in a
position to take criticism..warranted or unwarranted...I am confused by
your term "official" and for some reason I can't communicate to you that..a
GSDCA List with a roster of PC members only( you don't have to be on it if
you choose not to be) would simply be an "additional" List where open
discussion among members can take place about National
sites...elections..upcoming agenda of the Board..Candidates may openly
discuss their positions of different issues...without the input and in some
cases, criticism of those who are not interested in being part of the club.
those who are excluded..want to be excluded. I am equally confused by your
statement that "people will read and take what is said as fact" who can
control that? do we control it on this List? do we control that at dog
shows..much information is repeated as fact..and found not to be
true..there is no way to legislate this in real life..or on the Internet!
As stated..these ideas are a work in progress..most have been well received
by many..and I fully expected some to take exception...and to be
critical..and for some to be just down right insulting..but I am trying to
offer suggestions for our club to better itself...I am asking for your
explanation..not being critical..C.Grainger
> [Original Message]
> From: PlushPuppyOhio
> To: ;
> Date: 8/23/2005 9:44:34 AM
> Subject: [ SHOWGSD-L ] Re: IS THE GSDCA TOO DESPERATE?LONG SORRY
>
> Go for it Christine. Im not debating my point as you seem more intent on
proving yours than coming simpkly addressing questions raised in a civil
manner. You obviously read my post with objections. Nowhere did I say
the lists would withhold information. Nowhere did I say you were
advocating anything like that. And just because I raise questions or a
different point of view certainly doesnt mean I didnt read what you said.
I simply was asking that if there is an "official" list.... knowing the
discussions that start.... and knowing there is no way to address
everything... will people read the list, and take words that are said as
fact. At least on this least... we know a majority of what is said is
OPINION. It is a private list. If we advocate a PC list.... does the
info within suddenly have the appearance of being more "official".
>
> Nevermind though. Obviously you have thought things out, and you know
what is best. Im all for trying new things... so go for it!!!
>
>
>
>
> Steve Grainger wrote:
> As I sated in my original post..we will have some who say "We can't" or It
> won't" or Who's going to"..Chaos is exactly what we have now..rumors
> already spread rampant..where have you been?.perhaps you missed this
> information..the List as we know it would stay the
same..informational..you
> can talk about anything with the exception of PC business. so those who
for
> some reason don't want to join..can still have access to GSD
information..I
> did not advocate taking away information(is this how rumors get
started..by
> not reading my complete post?) GSd fanciers will still via the current
List
> find out about health, education...handling..you name it..just like
> now..BUT AGAIN not be privy to discussion about the inner workings of the
> GSDCA. The group I work for has monthly staff meetings..these meeting are
> private..not open to the public because the information discussed is
> confidential..and should be fodder for public discussion. I understand
> that in Ft. Collins..4 of the biggest dissenters for the site were
> non-members..why should they have a voice?. Again..we have many
non-members
> giving input about where nationals should be or not be...criticizing the
> board...asking to see the NIS..we have nearly 4000 members..and a
> wellspring of untapped talent..are you saying we couldn't find someone
else
> in 4000 members to monitor a GSDCA sponsored List???? Again..being a
member
> of the GSDCA should have with it some perks...most want to join a
> confident, growing progressive organization..when you give too much
> away..in terms of information or other benefits to non-members...you
> diminish the value of 'belonging" to the club...remember..it is a
> "club"..and every club I know does not allow outsiders to have input in
the
> inner workings of the organization..C.Grainger
>
>
> > [Original Message]
> > From: PlushPuppyOhio
>
> > To: ;
> > Date: 8/23/2005 7:49:28 AM
> > Subject: [ SHOWGSD-L ] Re: IS THE GSDCA TOO DESPERATE?LONG SORRY
> >
> > Are we afraid of the "knowledge" non-members might offer? What is the
> benefit of forming a discussion to exclude? The list could certainly
> never initiate a vote, as not all members have access to the computer.
> Why create yet ANOTHER list... and ask the PC to sponser it to boot? Who
> would monitor it? Who would be responsible for discussions raised? Is
> the board going to be accountable for every subject that comes up every
day
> on the list? Are rumors going to spread rampid when something is brought
> up that isnt addressed?
> >
> > I think there should be designated times and locations that official
> GSDCA business should be conducted. The Board meeting for example.
> Anything else to me is just asking for Chaos. Our Local clubs should be a
> way to filter information back to the membership. Do we have Board
> designees from each "area"? Has that ever been considered. Then that
> Board member has "x" amount of clubs it represents?
> >
> >
> >
> > Melissa wrote:
> > I also agree there should be a list strictly for GSDCA members to
discuss
> > club business. As far as show results, since we don't limit
> > entry/exhibition at these shows only to GSDCA members, that should
remain
> > available to the public.
> >
> > JMO,
> > Melissa
> >
> >
>
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> > POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the
> original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or
FORWARDS
> of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author
> AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED.
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> > ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN
ANY
> MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS
> PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY
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> POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the
original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS
of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author
AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED.
>
> ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY
MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS
PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY
FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE
PROSECUTED.
>
> For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx
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POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the original
author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind
are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the
Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED.
ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY
MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS
PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY
FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE
PROSECUTED.
For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx
VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://www.showgsd.org
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POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the original
author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind
are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the
Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED.
ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY
MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS
PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY
FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE
PROSECUTED.
For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx
VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://www.showgsd.org
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