_____ From: lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Simon Ward Sent: Sunday, May 07, 2006 1:04 PM To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: Helm's World Andy: 'Just think, you guys gave us America.' Don't let Lawrence hear you say that, he's busy re-writing history. We also begat Australia. Enough said. 'We're wondering what a non-military war looks like? A war of words? A Matrix-style war, where one side thinks it's winning and the other side is losing?' I was attempting to differentiate between the two world wars and 'modern' ones. Where WW1 was essentially a war about market supremacy and empires, and WW2 was about defeating fascism, modern wars are about regional domination. During the cold war they were fought between client states. Post cold war they are about racial disharmony, arms markets and, under the Bush doctrine, capital markets. But not freedom, democracy or the end of terror. Note that without terror, the US Empire cannot expand. 'I would imagine that not having a war in Europe in the 60 years following WWI and WWII would not be too surprising. It was a pretty traumatizing experience. It has to be for that reason that our administration is so gung ho on war, because they never experienced it first hand.' This is something that Lawrence seems to forget with his sniping at Europe and France in particular. Millions of lives were lost in both world wars and he has to ask why France (and Germany though they never seem to get a mention) are somewhat down on going to war. Of course, the response is that the US was responsible for maintaining the peace during the cold war, but does that automatically mean that Europe is obliged to follow when they embark on Empire building. You're right, I think, that the Bush Administration discounts the experience of war on the ground. Yes, the body bags come back - though that isn't shown on TV - but to have homes and infrastructure destroyed, to become refugees, to die of starvation, in short to suffer the experience of war is absolutely alien. '...there's no way Lawrence is going to see that only peace begets peace, that democracy can't be forced at gunpoint. I think it's time to pack it in on that quarter and watch Lawrence save the world by destroying it while feeling superior to everyone else for not joining him.' Ah but I enjoy the challenge. And Lawrence enjoys it too I'm sure. I can sense him thrashing away at his keyboard even now, his fingers dropping bombs onto the list, each stroke a small explosion until that final full stop leads to the truimphant click of his index finger that sends the next war-winning note into the ether. (Just don't tell him that an Englishman invented html). Regards Simon PS. From the font changes and the remote references to Irene, I'm guessing that this is the husband I'm speaking to. Welcome to Helm's World.