>Is it the user or is it the design? Is the old way proper or is the proper way one that is easier to work with in toto? But NOT in this case! When designing a form, there are TWO modes...the design mode and the user mode. Makes sense, right? Does to me! If you're designing a form, you do NOT want to accidentally leave data in the fields from testing, cos' then that data would be left in your master...which SHOULD be blank. So it makes sense to have the design mode default to leave the fields blank, so as not to cause the designer extra work. However, because some users ATTEMPT to create forms, but don't understand the basics of design mode and user mode, they mess with the document outside of the design mode, yet while using designer features...unprotect/protect...and then complain that their fields were blanked out! Well, DUH! Open the damn form to add design...in design mode...and you won't have a problem! But NO! MS changes form creation rules and now the designer must REMEMEBER to blank out the fields before they save it. So now it's easier for those folks who are too lazy to RTFM and follow directions. But those of us who DO RTFM and follow direction are punished with more work. Which is why I won't recommend XP and still write all my forms in 2000! :-P <g> Dian Chapman Technical Consultant, Instructor, Microsoft MVP & TechTrax Editor Word AutoForm/VBA eBook: http://www.mousetrax.com/books.html Tutorial web site: http://www.mousetrax.com/techpage.html TechTrax Ezine: http://www.mousetrax.com/techtrax/ -----Original Message----- From: mso-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:mso-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Greg Chapman Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 5:53 PM To: mso@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [mso] Re: Is it worth changing over to?XP ? Yep, we only have an occasional disagreement on these things. But despite the fact that we all do things like this, lines like the following always get my attention: >I also have to work twice as hard to handle forms...now having to clear my development fields cos' some folks can't handle learning how to create forms properly. Is it the user or is it the design? Is the old way proper or is the proper way one that is easier to work with in toto? That's an age old question. Has anyone here ever heard an argument between old timers who complain that they are much faster on the keyboard than with a mouse and the argument they get from the mouse proponent? The truth is that both sides are right on particular points and wrong on others. On this particular issue, I side with the user simply because FormFields in Word are not and have never been in compliance with the behavior intended by the designers of the platform (OS). That's one of my major grumbles with Lotus Notes, too. It takes Word's problems to the extreme, of course, and the lack of consistency with the host OS is why we also have extended discussions about the inability to select only portions of text within a cell, ad infinitum. In fact, Word is a pretty good example of a program that has had many problems turn into unchangeable beasts. The bugs and their associated workarounds are so well known to long time users that to actually fix those problems causes a lot of pain for a lot of people. Careful with that axe, Eugene! Sometimes we do need to move ahead and some other things are cherished and remain the same. Many Windows 3.1 users hated Windows 95's interface...and that old interface isn't normally available anymore (starting with XP) but 7 years ought to have been enough time for them to catch on. In other cases, stability wins. Why is Solaris the Enterprise solution of choice? Well, it's a pretty stable design on good hardware. Have to use a sledgehammer to break it and the code I write for it today will still work in 10 years (although that 10 year old code should have been retired). So someone explain the move to .Net and what that's going to do to Office users who also develop using Office? I'm betting the Access developers who are just starting out today will drive that market and the old Access authors will come behind them. But even they will outpace Word and Excel authors since these people have learned VBA deeply and many of the things we take for granted in VBA today will really mess up our day tomorrow as we attempt to move forward. I can get on either side of this fence pretty easily but the one thing I can count on is that whatever I'm doing today on Windows and Office systems is different from what I will be doing on it in the future. That makes my answer a resigned "Might as well go now and get used to it, 'cause BillG ain't havin' none of this argument."<g> Greg Chapman http://www.mousetrax.com "Counting in binary is as easy as 01, 10, 11! With thinking this clear, is coding really a good idea?" > -----Original Message----- > From: mso-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > [mailto:mso-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Dian Chapman > Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 4:13 PM > To: mso@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > Subject: [mso] Re: Is it worth changing over to?XP ? > > > > ************************************************************* You are receiving this mail because you subscribed to mso@xxxxxxxxxxxxx or MicrosoftOffice@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To send mail to the group, simply address it to mso@xxxxxxxxxxxxx To Unsubscribe from this group, send an email to mso-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?Subject=unsubscribe Or, visit the group's homepage and use the dropdown menu. This will also allow you to change your email settings to digest or vacation (no mail). //www.freelists.org/webpage/mso To be able to use the files section for sharing files with the group, send a request to mso-moderators@xxxxxxxxxxxxx and you will be sent an invitation with instructions. Once you are a member of the files group, you can go here to upload/download files: http://www.smartgroups.com/vault/msofiles ************************************************************* ************************************************************* You are receiving this mail because you subscribed to mso@xxxxxxxxxxxxx or MicrosoftOffice@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To send mail to the group, simply address it to mso@xxxxxxxxxxxxx To Unsubscribe from this group, send an email to mso-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?Subject=unsubscribe Or, visit the group's homepage and use the dropdown menu. This will also allow you to change your email settings to digest or vacation (no mail). //www.freelists.org/webpage/mso To be able to use the files section for sharing files with the group, send a request to mso-moderators@xxxxxxxxxxxxx and you will be sent an invitation with instructions. Once you are a member of the files group, you can go here to upload/download files: http://www.smartgroups.com/vault/msofiles *************************************************************