[access-uk] Re: RNIB, how inefficient are they?

  • From: Dave Sheridan <dsheridan65@xxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: "access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2015 14:59:15 +0000

Amen to this Mike, totally agree. 

I raised this matter Steve because of access technology and RNIB's inability to 
enable use of the technology because of their treatment to a number of their 
client group. It felt important to raise the matter as others have recently 
regarding Overdrive and instructions for telephone handsets bought from RNIB. 
I'm sure George will let us know if we're to close the thread.   

Dave 

Sent from my iPhone

> On 22 Jan 2015, at 14:21, Mike Ray <mike@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> 
> 
> Braille is important:
> 
> 1.  A piece of paper with dots on it doesn't stop working when the power
> goes off and it doesn't have batteries that go flat.
> 
> 2.  Small items can be labelled with Braille and negate the need for
> gadgets like the Pen Friend which, although a fantastic little gizmo, is
> overkill for stuff like labelling CD cases.
> 
> 3.  Braille not3es and note taking are easier when you're on the move.
> 
> 4.  Braille is less intrusive if you're sitting in a metting/conference
> with a whole bunch of sighted folks.  If you're giving some kind of
> presentation just a page with a few lines of Braille on it makes no
> sound and is, after all, synonymous with how a sighted person refers to
> notes in a similar situation.
> 
> I would encourage, ne plead, all visually impaired youngsters to
> continue to learn and keep using Braille.
> 
> We owe it to those who have gone before and those coming after us to
> keep it alive.
> 
> 
> 
>> On 22/01/2015 14:15, Jackie Brown wrote:
>> Well Karl, you are definitely wide of the mark on that score although, of
>> course, you are entitled to your opinion, (smile).  I agree it has become an
>> even more expensive format, but one that those of us who prefer it are
>> entitled to have provided when ordering items from RNIB.  I notice that when
>> I order from them nowadays, I have to ask, and often have clarified, that I
>> want Braille instructions.  For smaller items it really doesn't matter, but
>> for something more complex it is useful.
>> 
>> 
>> Kind regards,
>> 
>> Jackie Brown
>> Emails: thebrownsplace@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Jackieannbrown62@xxxxxxxxx
>> jackie@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Website: www.thebrownsplace.info
>> Twitter: @thebrownsplace
>> Skype: thejackmate
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
>> Karl Proud
>> Sent: 22 January 2015 13:49
>> To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: [access-uk] Re: RNIB, how inefficient are they?
>> 
>> I guess that some people do see the printed word as old tech, certainly the
>> school my kids go to seem pretty obsessed with tablets etc.  I'm afraid that
>> I am one of those blind folk who do consider braille old fuddy duddy
>> technology, but then again I'm wrong about most things.
>> 
>> Karl
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On 22 Jan 2015, at 1:33 pm, Mike Ray <mike@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> The RNIB now seems to be run by suits with little or no grasp of what the
>> customers really need.
>> 
>> In a world where everything is being dumbed-down to a lowest common
>> denominator what we are now seeing is charity bosses who see little else
>> than the bottom line.  How they got to that bottom line is of little
>> importance to them.  Just making the expenditure smaller and the income
>> bigger seems to be an end in itself now.
>> 
>> And no doubt one of the things that is pared to the bone to make the bottom
>> line look better is training for customer facing staff and expenditure on
>> what is seen as old technology.  And sadly Braille is perceived by sighted
>> folks, and a lot of blind folks now too, as old tech.  Although presumably
>> sighted folks don't regard reading printed words as old tech.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On 22/01/2015 13:16, Clive.Lever@xxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
>>> Hi Dave,
>>> 
>>> Don't get me on my soap box about this one. Cynically, I sometimes wonder
>> whether the more they can dissuade congenitally blind people from blocking
>> their resources with loads of braille, the more they can concentrate on
>> their pet subject: "sight loss". If they tell customers as a matter of
>> course that braille copies will cost loads, take ages or generate boatloads
>> of paper, they will get the answer they nudged their customer to give: "Ok
>> then, I'll have an audio version". Then they will say: "more and more people
>> are using audio and fewer are reading braille, so Braille's on its way out".
>> Whooppee! They won't have to devote resources to it. Is there such a thing
>> as "Lowp! (the opposite of hype), or of demoting rather than promoting a
>> service? I encountered similar problems when I was asking for computer
>> manuals as far back as 1982, so sadly, your tale leads me to think nothing
>> has changed, except that the Institute sometimes appears to be suffering
>> from sight loss itself..
>> .i
>>> t's lost sight of the ball! I've usually found that a rough equation
>> stands me in good stead: Two-and-a-half to three braille pages for every a4
>> side of dense print in a pretty standard font size. So, when I read the
>> original was 96 pages, I thought "300's going to be nearer the mark. I read
>> on, And surprise, surprise!
>>> 
>>> Best,
>>> Clive
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On 
>>> Behalf Of Dave Sheridan
>>> Sent: 22 January 2015 12:37
>>> To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Subject: [access-uk] RNIB, how inefficient are they?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> I recently received a Plextalk pocket portable daisy player as a present.
>> The kind person who gave me this enquired about braille instructions and was
>> told that they could do this but they would be about 600 pages. The person
>> accepted that audio instructions would suffice. After receipt of said player
>> I rang to ask for braille instructions and was told the same thing. I asked
>> for the braille copy. Interestingly the audio contents goes up to page 96 so
>> I was a little confused why this would translate to 600 braille pages. I've
>> just received the instructions in 3 volumes totalling just under 300 A4
>> pages. Clearly those people providing potential customers with information
>> should be well informed and clearly they are not: 
>>> 
>>> To add to this a friend of mine who took out a subscription to the talking
>> book service has been perplexed by RNIB sending books which don't appear on
>> the list she supplied them with. This has occurred twice now within a short
>> period of time, firstly with books she hadn't ordered appearing on a pen
>> drive sent to her and since then having changed to disc she has been sent
>> other titles not ordered by her. Having experienced this myself over some
>> considerable time before I was blunt with them I I do wonder why their
>> customer service is so poor. As you have to ask for braille instructions
>> these days you would think they would give good information and not try to
>> put you off getting them to do the job they are there to do. 
>>> 
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>> 
>> 
>> --
>> Michael A. Ray
>> Analyst/Programmer
>> Witley, Surrey, South-east UK
>> 
>> Don't judge my disability until you witness my ability
>> 
>> Interested in accessibility on the Raspberry Pi?
>> Visit: http://www.raspberryvi.org/
>> From where you can join our mailing list for visually-impaired Pi hackers
>> ** To leave the list, click on the immediately-following link:-
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> 
> 
> -- 
> Michael A. Ray
> Analyst/Programmer
> Witley, Surrey, South-east UK
> 
> Don't judge my disability until you witness my ability
> 
> Interested in accessibility on the Raspberry Pi?
> Visit: http://www.raspberryvi.org/
> From where you can join our mailing list for visually-impaired Pi hackers
> ** To leave the list, click on the immediately-following link:-
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