Joe, I don't think we have too much difference about what's physical based on what you've said though I'm certainly not in the quale camp. I think, though, that the really important differences in our views came out in that last post you did and which I have already responded to. So we don't need to pay too much attention to what I take to be differences that aren't material to the question of the challenge posed to Dennett's model by your interpretation of von Neumann's quantum theory claim. So let's focus on what came out in that other post then, i.e., whether there is an argument in your interpretation of von Neumann for an extra-physical feature of what we mean by consciousness or whether it is just a matter of our working with different assumptions, reflecting a different conceptualization on each of our parts. If it is this latter, then there is probably no way to argue it as it will just be a matter of how we each see (as in "understand") the referent of the word "consciousness". -- SWM ========================================= Need Something? Check here: http://ludwig.squarespace.com/wittrslinks/