Out of interest I found this link which looks interesting. http://www.apcmag.com/apc/v3.nsf/0/51D1D443A868B5E4CA256D47000FB994 They mention you can set the ratio between the foreground and background priority they also have some other interesting registry settings regarding memory (one that jumps out is LargeSystemCache. Would anyone who's played with these settings have some comments about making use of them? I mean should I be fine tuning the systems at this level, or is this a case of one step forward two back? Regards Steven -----Original Message----- From: Brian Lilley [mailto:Brian.Lilley@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] Sent: 16 September 2003 04:34 To: 'thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx' Subject: [THIN] Re: thread quanta and chkroot.cmd thingy hhhhmm... OT but, an English billions is different to a US Billion... i.e. UK is a thousand million and the US is a million million... in computer terms am I right in thinking it is a thousand million?? -----Original Message----- From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] Sent: 16 September 2003 15:09 To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [THIN] Re: thread quanta and chkroot.cmd thingy FYI GHz is Giga (Billion) not Mega (Million)! :) -----Original Message----- From: Brian Madden [mailto:brian@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] Sent: 16 September 2003 03:59 To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [THIN] Re: thread quanta and chkroot.cmd thingy OK Everyone, I have my own theory on this. But first, step back and take a look at who has had input (either directly or indirectly) on this thread: Rick Dehlinger Kevin Goodman Rick Mack Tim Mangan Mark Russinovich David Solomon I mean wow! This is why this group rocks! These people are the best of the best. What are the results of this thread? Some say change the setting to foreground mode and some say change to background mode. Not everyone agrees. One thing is known for sure. The actual foreground (application) or background (server) mode "performance boost" doesn't really matter since "foreground" applications are only at the server console. However, what does matter is the fact that changing this setting also affects the amount of time (quanta) that any process has guaranteed access to the processor. If you want my opinion (which you're going to get whether you want it or not), I would bet (although unsubstantiated) that it doesn't really matter in a Terminal Server environment. Here's why I think this setting doesn't matter: Based entirely on information from this thread, it appears that the maximum allowed time slice we're dealing with here (based on this setting) is either 180ms or 30-60ms (this changes depending on number of processors, etc.) Well, if you have a server running at 1GHz, you have one million clock ticks for each millisecond. 180M ticks in 180ms, and 30M-60M ticks in 30-60ms. I would think that an individual process probably wouldn't need that much time. Furthermore, I would think that the system couldn't possibly give that much time away anyway. For example, if a thread was able to use its full 180ms time slice, only 5.5 threads would execute per second. Imagine you have a server with 50 users. In order for each user to get access to the CPU at least once per second, they would need to have threads execute for them for a maximum of 20ms. (1s / 50users = 0.02s each). This is well under even the 30ms limit as configured by this setting. Then, on top of that, remember that each user has multiple threads running, etc, and that they need access to the server more than once per second. I guess my point is that in a Terminal Server environment, I can't possibly imagine a single thread coming anywhere near the time slice/quanta limit, whether the limit is 30ms, 60ms, or 180ms. My completely theoretical and totally unsubstantiated theory: This setting does not matter on a Terminal Server. Brian Brian Madden 202.302.3657 brian@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx -------- Visit www.brianmadden.com for thin client white papers, books, product reviews, courseware, and training videos. I guess my "official" policy on this will be that I don't know. If you want more performance and have the time to play, then try changing it. -----Original Message----- From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Mack, Rick Sent: Tuesday, September 16, 2003 7:21 AM To: 'thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx' Subject: [THIN] Re: thread quanta and chkroot.cmd thingy Hi Brian, Got into a discussion with Rick Dehlinger about this a few years ago and called in Mark Russinovich as a referee. His opinion was that it does matter. Smaller timeslices (quanta) mean a more responsive system when you've got a lot of processes, but at the cost of more context switches per second. So overall excecution efficiency is reduced a bit, but for applications getting keyboard input for example (word, excel etc) it means a whole lot smoother input/display. One side effect of large quanta is even more incredible end to end slewing when your'e using a mouse to navigate through a large spreadsheet. Of couse large quanta make a lot of sense for a small number of i/o intensive processes, but not terminal services. Regards, Rick Ulrich Mack rmack@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx Volante Systems 18 Heussler Terrace, Milton 4064 Queensland Australia tel +61 7 32467704 -----Original Message----- From: Brian Madden [mailto:brian@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] Sent: Tuesday, 16 September 2003 6:33 AM To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [THIN] Re: thread quanta and chkroot.cmd thingy So, after reading all these quanta things, does this setting really make a difference? I understand that Tim and/or Kevin are testing to see which setting is better, but wouldn't it not really matter since an adverse setting would only be impacted by what an administrator is actively running on the console? I would assume that this setting doesn't really matter in the real world? Brian Brian Madden 202.302.3657 brian@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx -------- Visit www.brianmadden.com for thin client white papers, books, product reviews, courseware, and training videos. -----Original Message----- From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Timothy Mangan Sent: Monday, September 15, 2003 1:07 PM To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [THIN] Re: thread quanta and chkroot.cmd thingy Simple test. The thread that owns the "foreground window" also gets a priority boost. You can see this in the performance monitor. Start a program (I like "regedit" because it only has one thread), bring up performance monitor: Add counter Thread: Current Priority for the thread(s) of the application to be tested. You will see the priority increase when the window had the focus. Works as console of TS session. tim -----Original Message----- From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] Sent: Monday, September 15, 2003 9:28 AM To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [THIN] Re: thread quanta and chkroot.cmd thingy Here is Kevin's response: His answer has made me curious. I can prove who is right with a small test. I'll let you know. Kevin Goodman CTO RTO Software * +1-678-455-5506 x702 6 +1-678-455-5551* kevin.goodman@xxxxxxxxxxx Address: 5400 Laurel Springs Pkwy, #108 Suwanee, GA 30024 USA http://www.rtosoft.com Bernd Harzog CEO RTO Software, Inc. bernd.harzog@xxxxxxxxxxx 678-455-5506 x701 www.rtosoft.com -----Original Message----- From: Ron Oglesby [mailto:roglesby@xxxxxxxxxxxx] Sent: Monday, September 15, 2003 9:22 AM To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [THIN] Re: thread quanta and chkroot.cmd thingy Ok, no I have to allot some time today to test this. Ron Oglesby Senior Technical Architect RapidApp Office 312.372.7188 Mobile 815.325.7618 email roglesby@xxxxxxxxxxxx -----Original Message----- From: Andrew Rogers [mailto:Andrew.Rogers@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] Sent: Monday, September 15, 2003 8:12 AM To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [THIN] Re: thread quanta and chkroot.cmd thingy Interesting, RTOSoft vs TMurgent - whos right? You really know how to ask good questions Brian!! :) Andrew --o-- ******************************************************** This Week's Sponsor: ThinPrint http://www.thinprint.com ********************************************************** Useful Thin Client Computing Links are available at: http://thethin.net/links.cfm For Archives, to Unsubscribe, Subscribe or set Digest or Vacation mode use the below link: http://thethin.net/citrixlist.cfm ******************************************************** This Week's Sponsor: ThinPrint http://www.thinprint.com ********************************************************** Useful Thin Client Computing Links are available at: http://thethin.net/links.cfm For Archives, to Unsubscribe, Subscribe or set Digest or Vacation mode use the below link: http://thethin.net/citrixlist.cfm ******************************************************** This Week's Sponsor: ThinPrint http://www.thinprint.com ********************************************************** Useful Thin Client Computing Links are available at: http://thethin.net/links.cfm For Archives, to Unsubscribe, Subscribe or set Digest or Vacation mode use the below link: http://thethin.net/citrixlist.cfm ******************************************************** This Week's Sponsor: ThinPrint http://www.thinprint.com ********************************************************** Useful Thin Client Computing Links are available at: http://thethin.net/links.cfm For Archives, to Unsubscribe, Subscribe or set Digest or Vacation mode use the below link: http://thethin.net/citrixlist.cfm ******************************************************** This Week's Sponsor: ThinPrint http://www.thinprint.com ********************************************************** Useful Thin Client Computing Links are available at: http://thethin.net/links.cfm For Archives, to Unsubscribe, Subscribe or set Digest or Vacation mode use the below link: http://thethin.net/citrixlist.cfm ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ---- ---------------------------------------- The information contained in this e-mail is confidential and may be subject to legal professional privilege. 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