[SI-LIST] Re: Do you ever measure any of the things you model?
- From: "Muranyi, Arpad" <Arpad_Muranyi@xxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2008 18:57:37 -0700
Chris,
SSO is a fairly difficult thing to model behaviorally,
but we have at least two BIRD-s which intend to provide
means to the legacy IBIS style behavioral modeling to
help that situation.
BIRD 95.6:
http://www.vhdl.org/pub/ibis/birds/bird95.6.txt
and BIRD 98.3:
http://www.vhdl.org/pub/ibis/birds/bird98.3.txt
Since we are getting very close to the release of the
next major revision of the IBIS specification, these
BIRD's will most likely become an official part of the
IBIS 5.0 spec rather soon.
And the reason I used the words "legacy IBIS style" above
is because if someone is not shy about using any of the
*-AMS extensions of IBIS, they can write out their heart's
content using those modeling languages to include any SSO
effect they wish. These extensions have been available
since IBIS 4.1 was ratified in January of 2004.
I agree, it may be debatable whether it is easier to
simulate SSO with transistor models instead of figuring
out how to model those effects behaviorally. However,
I would like to caution the non-suspecting bystander
that more transistor models than you would like to see
make use of that handy little shorthand feature called
.global, making SSO simulations useless or impossible.
Add to that some encryption, and you are out of luck.
Arpad
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
-----Original Message-----
From: Chris Cheng [mailto:Chris.Cheng@xxxxxxxx]=20
Sent: Monday, March 31, 2008 6:32 PM
To: Muranyi, Arpad; si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [SI-LIST] Re: Do you ever measure any of the things you =
model?
There is always this little problem called memory. FBDIMM is not taking =
off. DDR2/3 is around everywhere.
I guarantee you I've seen SSO in DDR channels, a lot. How does one =
correlate DDR models without SSO ?
-----Original Message-----
From: si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Muranyi, Arpad
Sent: Monday, March 31, 2008 6:25 PM
To: si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: Do you ever measure any of the things you model?
Chris,
I think the dance floor is called SERDES these days. I haven't
seen anyone using transistor level models in that field to get
BER estimates down to double digit exponents. Whether it is
done in C, Matlab, *-AMS, doesn't matter, its still behavioral
modeling, isn't it? Of course, this is a slightly different
topic from matching I-V and V-t curves, but no one can escape
the correlation steps in this world either, as they shouldn't
in the SPICE world either... And I think this thread started
mainly around the topic of correlation.
Arpad
----------------------------------------------------------------
-----Original Message-----
From: Chris Cheng [mailto:Chris.Cheng@xxxxxxxx]=3D20
Sent: Monday, March 31, 2008 5:31 PM
To: Muranyi, Arpad; si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [SI-LIST] Re: Do you ever measure any of the things you =3D
model?
Arpad,
I don't think we need to go into a flame war again.
I just want to know who is actually shipping IBIS 4.0 or 4.1 models to =
=3D
customer that can do SSO.
We are all dress up, I need to know where's the party ?
The Gala Ball of SPICE models for customers with ten million dollar PO =
=3D
is out of my league, I am settling for the IBIS for the mass punk rave. =
=3D
Please tell me where is the dance floor ?
------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe from si-list:
si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'unsubscribe' in the Subject field
or to administer your membership from a web page, go to:
//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list
For help:
si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'help' in the Subject field
List technical documents are available at:
http://www.si-list.net
List archives are viewable at:
//www.freelists.org/archives/si-list
or at our remote archives:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-list/messages
Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at:
http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu
Other related posts:
