That's certainly the article. I thought it was a worthwhile reference because it seems to present middle ground between the two polarised positions that we take. Fukuyama presents a model of fundamentalist islam that arises not exclusively from a cultural/religious background but also from feelings of alienation from the west. For me, this is of prime importance because, as I see it, the most important variable to be considered is the manner and the reasons for movement from traditional islam to fundamentlist islam. (I wonder whether the process is in anyway similar to conversions to fundamentlist christianity). It is this dynamic more than any other that needs to be understood if the west is to influence the growth of the fundamentlists. As I see it, waging war as the sole weapon in a fight with fundamentlism can only serve to increase the enemy numbers because it is exactly what the fundamentlists will preach to those they hope to attract. Similarly, making no effort to fix the problems in the middle east, such as Isreal/Palestine, and showing a disregard for the opinions of the world's majority, only serves to prove the fundamentlists right. For those unware of what is said elsewhere, Lawrence has discussed the importance of marginalising the fundamentalists within islam. Whether this is what Lawrence believes should happen, or whether it is him reporting on the scholarship of others is beside the point, it's an impoirtant consideration. Conversely, to present a model of fundamentalism that is restricted to the cultural/religious 'pull' of tight readings of the Koran - in other words to assume that whatever the west does has no influence of the traditionalist to fundamentalist dynamic - serves to excuse the actions of west. It says that the west bears no responsibility for its actions because those actions have no effect on the creation of fundamentalists. Fukuyama says the terrorists created in the first world (historically the more active) are essentially a political phenomenon. He also says that Europe's version of multiculturalism has to shoulder some of the blame for what it has helped to create. The one statement marries with what I've been saying, the other with Lawrence. As such I think the article a good basis for discussion. Simon ----- Original Message ----- From: Lawrence Helm To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Monday, February 26, 2007 12:55 AM Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: Traditionalist Islam I still couldn't get it, and I tried Omar's site as well. I always got sent back to the same Prospect-Magazine site; so I did a Google Search on the articles written by Fukuyama for Prospect Magazine and then chose the latest which is entitled "Identity and Migration." It is from Issue 131, dated February 2007. I assume this is the one you are referring to. It is interesting. It builds somewhat on his End of Civilization and America at the Crossroads. And he continues to invoke Olivier Roy's Globalized Islam, the search for a New Ummah. But he may be keying to some extent off of Samuel Huntington's book Who are we -- The Challenges to America's National Identity; which I haven't read. I don't know what in this article (if this is the article) especially interested you. If it is the idea that the terrorist were influenced more by alienation in Europe than Qutbist ideology, I discussed that at some length after reading America at the Crossroads and Globalized Islam. It is an interesting theses. We can't know for sure whether the radicals, the activists engaged in overt acts of war, are small in number and isolated in circumstances or are merely the latest recruits from 300 million Fundamentalist Muslims -- and that number, some think, is growing? If we look at the dearth of terrorist activities in the US since 9/11, we could almost believe Roy's thesis, but as Fukuyama implies in the article, a rise of terrorism in Europe seems inevitable. He writes, "Whatever its exact causes, Europe's failure to better integrate its Muslims is a ticking time bomb that has already contributed to terrorism. It is bound to provoke a sharper backlash from populist groups, and may even threaten European democracy itself. Lawrence At 02:49 PM 2/25/2007, you wrote: "When I click on your reference I get Issue # 132 and don't see anything in it by Fukuyama" Try: http://www.prospect-magazine.co.uk/list.php?category=138&issue=549 The issue had changed. Please have a read and comment if you care to. We can continue the discussion after. Simon ----- Original Message ----- From: Lawrence Helm To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Sunday, February 25, 2007 10:33 PM Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: Traditionalist Islam When I click on your reference I get Issue # 132 and don't see anything in it by Fukuyama.