Eric Yost wrote: "Put yet another way, if I speak Spanish to argue against the position that Spanish is the only language, I am not reinforcing the contention that only Spanish exists. Rather I am attempting, however clumsily, to communicate with someone on their own terms." A small point, since I don't want to take away from the other interesting conversations Eric is involved in. If Eric is wanting to show that there is more to this world than logic and rationality, then I happily agree with him. I also am fairly certain Walter would agree as well so I am not entirely sure who Eric is disagreeing with. But I have missed much of this thread so I may not appreciate the gist of Eric's comments. My point would be that to use language and ideas requires defining things according to what they are and what they are not. This requirement is one condition that makes language possible. It is also a condition that makes translation from one language into another, possible. There is more than language, but as soon as we want to reflect, understand, and discuss, we are within language, and its logic. Sincerely, Phil Enns Yogyakarta, Indonesia ------------------------------------------------------------------ To change your Lit-Ideas settings (subscribe/unsub, vacation on/off, digest on/off), visit www.andreas.com/faq-lit-ideas.html