Cheryl, Mr. Elmendorf is getting along in years. I'm not sure how old. But he doesn't computer. He's an engineer by profession but he's old school, I guess one would say. I wasn't aware of what Googling his name would result. You need to do the advanced search after the initial name of Richard Elmendorf. Add the word "geocentrism" and you will get a better group of sites. Here is the link that you come up with when you do that: http://www.google.com/search?as_q=Richard+Elmendorf&num=10&hl=en&client=lgtech-ws&btnG=Google+Search&as_epq=&as_oq=geocentrism&as_eq=&lr=&as_ft=i&as_filetype=&as_qdr=all&as_occt=any&as_dt=i&as_sitesearch=&safe=images Interestingly, a couple of times my own name came up. Once for this Freelist when I made an earlier post here about Mr. E. and another on Bad Astronomy when I brought his name up. I did not know that all of these posts are universally accessible like that. Live and learn, Gary Shelton ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cheryl B." <c.battles@xxxxxxxxxxx> To: <geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Saturday, February 19, 2005 8:41 AM Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Hello, group. > Gary -- When I punch Richard Elmendorf into Google I get a man in Wisconsin > with some business, nothing about any geocentrism. Does he have a website? > Cheryl > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Gary Shelton" <garylshelton@xxxxxxxxxxx> > To: <geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > Sent: Saturday, February 19, 2005 1:48 AM > Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Hello, group. > > > > Cheryl, > > > > Lord knows I'm not an expert but I will contribute this much. I don't > know > > of anybody who believes the strict "geocentric" definition as put forward > by > > Dr. Jones. That is the one where the earth is spinning, and the sun > > revolves around the earth counter-clockwise, but obviously not as fast, in > > the angular velocity factor, as the earth is turning. So this option you > > can just ignore, IMHO. Your Bad Astronomers are "heliocentrists" (or > > "acentrists" if you prefer) and would say the earth rotates and revolves > > around the sun just as do the other planets we can observe. > > > > We "geostatists" naturally feel that the Bible correctly states the truth > > when it says the earth is immovable. What this means is simply that the > > earth is indeed perfectly still in the most "preferred frame of reference" > > (to borrow the Einsteinian lingo) and that the sun, moon, stars, and > > everything else we see in the heavens is revolving daily around the earth > in > > a clockwise direction (for the most part), just as they appear to be doing > > to us here on earth. > > > > Biblically, the earth is a special place because it is mentioned directly > in > > Genesis 1:1. You will note there that God didn't tell us "In the > beginning > > God created the heaven and Halley's Comet." Or "Jupiter", or "Mars", > > "Venus", or even "the sun". He told us "the heaven and the earth". So in > > my mind that puts us in a special place right off the bat. Also, Genesis > > 1:14-17 speak of the reasons all of the heavenly bodies were created. > Those > > would be, you may remember, for "signs, seasons, days, years, and to give > > light upon the earth". I've said this a few times before on this forum > but > > it is perfectly clear that all of those reasons are reasons FOR THE EARTH. > > So that, logically, if the earth were not here, then neither would all the > > heavenly bodies. As I said, it is a most "preferred frame of > reference".... > > And that is what gets us in trouble with all the acentric atheistic > > Einsteinians. Because, of course, they would say there can be no such > thing > > in reality. All places, when looking out from that place, will appear to > > each be in the CENTER OF ALL; it's the cosmological principle. > > > > If you are following the geostatic view, then you understand that > everything > > revolves around the earth clockwise daily, including the sun and moon. > Your > > question about the 28 days concerns the moon's revolution about the earth > in > > the h-system. Keep in mind the h-view of the moon has it orbiting the > earth > > counter-cwise in around the 28 days. This speed is essential to > accurately > > account for the observed phases of the moon that we see on earth. > > > > Our view of the moon is that it orbits clockwise daily and that the moon's > > phases are explained by the difference in angular velocity between the > > slower moon and the faster sun, which both are orbiting the earth > clockwise > > daily. As for the sun the h-view has the earth orbiting it in 365 days > with > > a tilted axis to explain the seasons. The geostatic view has the untilted > > earth being orbited by the sun in what Richard Elmendorf described as a > > "double helix" pattern. This also explains the seasons. > > > > Remember again, that if you are on the moon watching the earth, you are > > moving as well as the earth you are watching, and in the final analysis, > you > > can't say whether it is you or the object of your eye (the earth) is > moving. > > Sounds rather Zen-like, doesn't it? > > > > I hope that is of help. I'm no expert so take everything I say with a > grain > > of salt always. The truth comes with repeated dives into the field of > > knowledge, not just one quick dip. > > > > Sincerely, > > > > Gary Shelton > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Cheryl B." <c.battles@xxxxxxxxxxx> > > To: <geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > > Sent: Friday, February 18, 2005 10:02 PM > > Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Hello, group. > > > > > > > I see the part about everything revolving around the earth once a day. > I > > > still don't see where the 28 days of the moon, and the other orbits of > the > > > planets, the 365 days per the sun come in. > > > > > > I've been hopping around the net looking for those answers and haven't > > found > > > them yet. Is there a simple answer to this question? > > > > > > I read Dr. Jones' landing on the moon essay over again, and seemed to > get > > > more out of it this time than before, and it is so fascinating. But I > > don't > > > claim to understand all of it. > > > > > > I am only of average intelligence when it comes to math. Physics was > > > something I flunked in high school. My forte is politics and religion. > > > > > > Cheryl > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Gary Shelton" <garylshelton@xxxxxxxxxxx> > > > To: <geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > > > Sent: Friday, February 18, 2005 9:13 PM > > > Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Hello, group. > > > > > > > > > > Cheryl, > > > > > > > > I think one thought that might assist you is to understand that if you > > are > > > > on the moon watching the earth, you are not at a standstill. You, > too, > > > are > > > > moving. You would not be able to say with absolute certainty whether > it > > > was > > > > the earth turning (heliocentrist) that you were watching or the moon's > > > > clockwise motion about the earth (geostatist). > > > > > > > > This is why it is often said that the only way to prove the issue is > to > > > step > > > > outside of the universe and look down onto things. > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > > > Gary Shelton > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Cheryl B." <c.battles@xxxxxxxxxxx> > > > > To: <geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > > > > Sent: Friday, February 18, 2005 7:42 PM > > > > Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Hello, group. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks. Could you explain the geocentrist model to me as simply as > > > > > possible? Is it as simple as that the earth is not moving and > > > everything > > > > is > > > > > going around us once every 24 hours? So that means the astronauts > on > > > the > > > > > moon would see what appears to be a revolving earth, going around > once > > > in > > > > 24 > > > > > hours. > > > > > > > > > > So where does the 28 days come in? > > > > > > > > > > Cheryl > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: "Gary Shelton" <garylshelton@xxxxxxxxxxx> > > > > > To: <geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > > > > > Sent: Friday, February 18, 2005 8:30 PM > > > > > Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Hello, group. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Cheryl, > > > > > > > > > > > > You need a good dose of Bad Astronomy. The folks there will > gladly > > > > > clarify > > > > > > any relative motion questions you have. But I suggest you browse > > > > through > > > > > a > > > > > > couple of topics that I participated in last year. You will > notice > > I > > > > > > thought like yourself in the beginning. > > > > > > > > > > > > The first is a topic that I actually started, unbelievable as that > > > seems > > > > > to > > > > > > me now.... > > > > > > > > > > > > "Relative Motion Falls Apart When applied to Planes" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.badastronomy.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=16726&postdays=0&postorder > > > > > =asc&start=0 > > > > > > > > > > > > The next is a topic begun by a devout acentrist athiest named > > > Maksutov. > > > > > > > > > > > > "Thinking about geocentrism" > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.badastronomy.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?p=350240&highlight=#350240 > > > > > > > > > > > > I did not agree with these people but I could not counter their > > > superior > > > > > > academic arguments. Still, it was interesting taking the battle > to > > > > "their > > > > > > turf". I personally believe that they made some good points and > we > > > need > > > > > to > > > > > > be able to answer all of them, just as the creationists have a > > counter > > > > to > > > > > > every single evolution premise put forward. > > > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > > > > > > > Gary Shelton > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > From: "Cheryl B." <c.battles@xxxxxxxxxxx> > > > > > > To: <geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > > > > > > Sent: Friday, February 18, 2005 10:31 AM > > > > > > Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Hello, group. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A friend told me the whole moon landing thing was staged in Las > > > Vegas, > > > > > > that > > > > > > > the film crew all had untimely deaths later, and they were > > pacified > > > > with > > > > > > > hookers and parties during hte shoot. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If they did go to the moon I'd like to know why not one single > > > > astronaut > > > > > > has > > > > > > > commented about observing the earth turning. I realize that it > > > takes > > > > 12 > > > > > > > hours for one side of the earth to completely move around, but > it > > > > would > > > > > > > still be apparent to anyone looking that the earth was turning. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you went to the moon and believed the earth was turning, > > wouldn't > > > > you > > > > > > > want to brag about having seen it with your own two eyes? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Cheryl > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > > > > > > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > > > > > > Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.8 - Release Date: 2/14/05 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > > > > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > > > > > Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.8 - Release Date: 2/14/05 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > > > > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > > > > Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.8 - Release Date: 2/14/05 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > > > Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.8 - Release Date: 2/14/05 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > > Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.8 - Release Date: 2/14/05 > > > > > > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.1.0 - Release Date: 2/18/05 > -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.1.0 - Release Date: 2/18/05