Paul, Sorry if I was a bit rude and gave you the impression that I dislike you! I may dislike the lies you believe in but I can assure you that I appreciate some of your comments and informations. In my last email, you totally missed my point again. All I wanted to show you is that there are physical reason to give a bias to the Earth based observer! As for your questions about Mars, I don't know and don't understand everything. First the observations of Mars are the same in HC and GC all (Mars) year around: we observe the same varying distances between Mars and the Earth. So the calculations should match. However, I believe that the Sun, in its yearly motion, carries with it its satellites (the planets revolving around it), just like Jupiter carries with it its satellites (its moons). So you would have to consider that motion in your calculations. But I don't claim to have the right answer for this. Marc V. ----- Original Message ----- From: Paul Deema Sent: 29 août 2007 11:51 To: Geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Earth and science Marc V, et al As ever -- comments in teal Paul wrote: «it was stated that an observer on any body in the system would, on pure observation and using the same reasoning as most here use to vindicate their beliefs, come to the conclusion that he was on a stationary body at the centre of the universe. They cannot all be right. I'll say it again -- they cannot all be correct and there is no physical reason which gives a bias to the Earth based observer.» Well Paul, your statement would be sound if it was true that we could find other observers on the planets revolving around the Sun. I did not make any suggestion that there were such observers in existence but we do not need them to make such a simple observation. You personally have drawn attention to the supposed interchangeability (see Note 1 below) which highlights the difficulty of determining whether or not the Earth is moving. If it were easy to distinguish, then a consensus would exist and we here would be looking for something else to do with our spare time! But since Earth is the only place where we can observe physical life and physical intelligent creatures living on it, your statement is biased by (one of) your gods : the Sun. Marc, you may dislike what I say and you may have come to dislike me personally but this does not give you the right to make disparaging suggestions as what my religious beliefs, if any, might be. The Sun has no life in it, it was put there for the convenience of the creatures (specially the intelligent ones) on Earth. To give as much importance to the Sun as do the heliocentrists is (at least) half way worshipping it. I could give you a longish list of biblical web sites which espouse heliocentricity and which I suspect would be much longer than any similar list of those espousing stationary Earth centrism. Marc V. Why do you (and et al) continue making these type of comments when there are specifics you could denounce, disprove, demolish, dispatch. I invite you again to address these comments -- HC says that Earth revolves around the Sun at a distance of 149.6 * 10^6 km; at a velocity of 29.78 km/s; in a CCW direction (looking from the North); Mars revolves around the Sun at a distance of 227.92 * 10^6 km; at a velocity of 24.13 km/s; in a CCW direction (looking from the North); and has a solid theoretical framework to explain why this is so. The difference is thus -5.65 km/s in velocity and 78.32 * 10^6 km between concentric, and essentially circular, orbits. On the other hand, GS says the Earth is stationary; Mars revolves (effectively) around the Earth in a CW direction (looking from the North); at distances varying from 78.32 * 10^6 km and 377.52 * 10^6 km; at velocities varying from (very roughly) 5.71 * 10^3 km/s and 27.53 * 10^3 km/s; and has no explanation for these assumptions. In the GS scenario, assuming we take the closest approach for a rendezvous, Mars is travelling in the opposite direction from that which the planners of the mission relied upon, at a velocity difference of 5.72 * 10^3 km/s + 5.65 km/s = 5.73 * 10^3 km/s. This is roughly Earth escape velocity -- a large percentage of the maximum capability of our best launch vehicles -- about 1000 times the velocity difference expected and in the opposite direction! Should the GS position be the truth, the chances of a successful rendezvous, if the mission is based on HC data, are zilch, zippo, nil. Paul D %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Note 1. you are showing every one on this forum that you can't grasp the "mind buggling" problem of symetry between HC and GC and their being geometrically interchangeable. Feel safe with award winning spam protection on Yahoo!7 Mail. Find out more.