[gameprogrammer] Re: Survey!!!!
- From: Bob Pendleton <bob@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: gameprogrammer@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 15:33:27 -0500
On Tue, 2005-09-27 at 08:14 +1000, Dave Slutzkin wrote:
> On Mon, 26 Sep 2005 16:40:54 -0500, "Bob Pendleton" <bob@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> said:
> > On Mon, 2005-09-26 at 08:41 -0700, joshua jones wrote:
> > > Would you pay a fee to go to a sort of LAN/online gaming palace, where
> > > there is nothing but games wall to wall...console, and PC all
> > > connected wirelessly with High-Speed internet acess, and occaisional
> > > pay to enter tournaments with prizes? And also what would you feel
> > > would be a reasonable price to pay to play for a full day???
> >
> > I spent quite a while looking into this business model and couldn't
> > figure out how to make it work. I have seen some articles indicating
> > that the way to go is to provide areas with a playstation or xbox, a big
> > screen tv, and one real comfy chair for each controller. The idea is to
> > provide the living room everyone really wants.
>
> Doing it for console gaming seems harder to me, as many console gamers
> will have a similar set up, or one not a lot worse, in their own house.
> So you've got a smaller market to aim at. And most console games look
> relatively horrible on big-screen TVs. I would expect PC games would
> work better.
I'm just reporting what I have read about successful set up like this.
The target is folks who make a lot money working in crowded cities like
New York where no one can afford a large living room with lots of comfy
chairs. They have the bucks to afford to pay a high price for the space
and service.
>
> > It has been tried several times here in Austin, it has never seemed to
> > last very long. The trouble is that it is just too easy to set up a
> > little switch and do a lan party were you are using your own computers.
> > Hey, I know folks who keep a PC, a switch, and a bunch of cables, in the
> > trunk of their car just in case they need it.
>
> Yeah, but these people aren't the intended audience. Hardcore gamers
> are likely to have quick net connections and great hardware, and maybe a
> LAN. You need to aim at the level below this; they don't have great
> hardware or don't have a good net connection, and almost certainly don't
> have a LAN. So if they want to play multiplayer with friends, they have
> to come to you. This audience is mostly made up of teenagers, because
> they probably don't have the cash or space or ability to set themselves
> up at home.
That is dead on. The trouble with targeting teenagers is that if they
don't have the money for a good PC and a LAN they also don't have the
money needed to support the set up you describe.
>
> So you can't make alcohol a central part of the experience, as that
> rules out a huge part of your market. You need to make it
> parent-friendly (permanent supervision, clean setting) but with solid
> cred for the kids (good hardware, good sysadmin, good branding). You
> may need many copies of games, as this makes it accessible to impulse
> play rather than just your regulars. (Is there a licensing issue? Not
> sure.) But this is debatable.
The licensing issue is pretty serious. Most games require you to
purchase one copy per PC. If you have 50 PCs, you need 50 copies. At
$50/copy that is $2500/game. If you want to have more than just a few
hot titles you are looking at $25,000 to $50,000 for an initial
investment in software. Then, you need to get copies of each new game
while it is still hot. So, you are looking at something like
$5,000/month to buy new titles.
>
> If you're doing PC games, by far the biggest expense is keeping hardware
> up to date. You'll probably need a tranche of new machines every three
> months, replacing 50% of your machines, or at least new hardware.
> Because otherwise why would people not just play at home? Not sure if
> you can charge more for newer hardware. But the bonus is that you can
> sell the 'old' stuff which will still be relatively new.
Yeah... sort of. The value of used equipment, even if you sell it your
self, is only 10 to 20 percent of its new price. This is especially true
if you are selling because it is obsolete. You offset the cost loss by
charging less to use slower machines, or by running buying new machines
to run new games. That way the hardware is balanced for the games it
runs. But, if you are looking at setting up 50 machines for you initial
site, you could be looking at spending $100,000 to $50,000 for hardware
that will be obsolete in 6 months to a year. You can extend its life by
adding RAM and new video cards... but still you are looking at a hefty
initial investment and a serious long term need for capital.
Hmm, I just reran the numbers for a simple cost model and it looks to me
like you would need to charge roughly $20/hour. If you could keep your
other costs really low you might get it down to $15. But, not matter how
I look at it you have to hope that your average customer drops
$100/visit. I don't see how that works out as a business. The people who
can afford it can afford to do it at home.
I really think this is something that only works where people are really
crammed together and housing is very expensive.
Bob Pendleton
>
> Dave.
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