[bksvol-discuss] Re: Protecting page numbers and chapter headings
- From: "Evan Reese" <mentat1@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Sat, 13 May 2006 18:08:22 -0700
How will NIMAS support help with the problems we have been talking about here?
----- Original Message -----
From: Gerald Hovas
To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Saturday, May 13, 2006 4:03 PM
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Protecting page numbers and chapter headings
The tools, including the Stripper, will need updating in order to support
NIMAS, and NIMAS support is definitely on Bookshare's list of things to do.
The problem is that tools like the Stripper are complex, and Bookshare has been
waiting until the major upgrade before attempting to tackle fixing it in order
to prevent having to rework it twice.
Gerald
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From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Jill O'Connell
Sent: Saturday, May 13, 2006 4:57 PM
To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Protecting page numbers and chapter headings
The problem with that, however, is that for one thing as I'm sure you've
noticed, scanners often don't see the headers in the same way on each page for
some reason; also I as a braille reader don't want to hear the headers on every
page; I can't speak for the DAISY readers. That's why I remove the headers when
scanning and try to remember to put stars or some other symbol above chapter
headings that occur at the top of the page. I hope this problem is high on
Bookshare's "fix-it" list.
----- Original Message -----
From: Evan Reese
To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Saturday, May 13, 2006 8:17 AM
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Protecting page numbers and chapter headings
Ok, now I'm more confused than ever. If I strip the headings manually,
then why does the stripper need something to strip. If I don't strip them,
then I need to make them consistent so the stripper can strip them correctly?
But if I do strip them, then I need to put a fake one at the beginning of each
chapter so the chapter heading doesn't get stripped? Do I have this all
correct? Wouldn't it be a lot simpler just to not strip anything? Aren't we
supposed - ideally anyhow - to be replicating the original book, in which there
is in fact a heading at the top of each page, except on those which begin a
chapter. This makes a lot of extra work and complexity and a reduction of
quality for those who can't keep straight all the persnickety demands of the
Bookshare software, or who don't have the time to go through and fix everything
just right so that other readers can have a decent reading experience. I would
say, just drop the whole stripping thing and make life simpler for everyone and
then we won't have these quality problems.
----- Original Message -----
From: Gerald Hovas
To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 4:18 PM
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Protecting page numbers and chapter headings
Donna,
1.. Yes, put a blank line before and after the page number when the
page number is in the header as well as a blank line at the bottom of the page.
I'm not sure if the blank line is necessary between the page number and the
text, but I can say that putting one after the header does work well. If you
leave the blank lines at the top and bottom of the pages off, then some odd
things will happen to the page numbers when the HTML file is created. The page
numbers end up as part of a paragraph instead of on a separate line.
Example of how the page should look...
[Page Break]
95
.
.
.
text
.
.
.
[Page Break]
2.. Yes, put a blank line between the chapter heading and the first
line of text. Again, I don't know that this is necessary, but it does work
well, and some people have said that it is necessary.
3. Yes, you need to give the Stripper something to strip other than the
chapter heading or the chapter heading will be stripped. The easiest thing to
do when page numbers are normally at the top of pages except on pages where a
chapter begins is to move the page number from the bottom of the page to the
top. If page numbers are always at the bottom of the page, then place a false
header above the chapter heading. Using the title works well, and it won't
look as odd if the Stripper fails to strip it for some odd reason. It helps to
strip all of the real headers manually since its easier to strip them yourself
than to insure that they are consistent so that the Stripper will remove them
all, but if you do leave them in, then just follow the pattern of the headers
and put whatever header would normally appear on the top of that page above the
chapter heading.
Examples of how pages should look...
[Page Break]
95
Chapter Seven
.
.
.
text
.
.
.
[Page Break]
[Page Break]
The Firm
Chapter Seven
.
.
.
text
.
.
.
95
[Page Break]
Or if the page would normally contain the author's name instead of the
title...
[Page Break]
John Grisham
Chapter Seven
.
.
.
text
.
.
.
[Page Break]
I can't say that these are the only ways to do it, but I've had excellent
results with these approaches.
HTH
Gerald
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From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Donna Smith
Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 5:41 PM
To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Protecting page numbers and chapter headings
Hi all.
I hesitate to ask this question, but I can't find the answer on any of
the official or unofficial sites giving tips to scanners.
Did we ever determine absolutely what should be done to protect page
numbers and chapter headings? What I want to know is:
1.. At the top of each page, do I need to put a blank line before
and/or after the page number?
2.. For chapter numbers/titles that appear at the top of the page, do I
put a blank line before and/or after it?
3.. Is it necessary to have something at the top of the page for the
BookShare stripper to strip?
I spend a good bit of time cleaning up each scan regarding page numbers,
chapter headings and stripping out unwanted headers. I'm trying to do it in
such a way that it will result in the best book in the finished product.
I really, really hope that an answer has been found to this question and
that I'm not opening up the can of worms we've had before about the different
perceptions of what might work. <smile>
Thanks.
Peace and Hope,
Donna
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