[THIN] Re: Cursor blink rate in Windows 2003...
- From: "Steve Greenberg" <steveg@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 15:29:25 -0700
Dag,=20
I am with on this and would like to suggest perhaps another approach- =
What
if Microsoft enabled an alternate character or color? i.e. what if you =
could
make the cursor, larger, or white, or some other characteristic which =
would
make it visiable without blinking?
Steve Greenberg
Thin Client Computing
34522 N. Scottsdale Rd. suite D8453
Scottsdale, AZ 85262
(602) 432-8649
(602) 296-0411 fax=20
steveg@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
-----Original Message-----
From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On =
Behalf
Of Sjolund, Dag
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2004 2:05 PM
To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [THIN] Re: Cursor blink rate in Windows 2003...
Thanks for checking on this, Claudio. I am not convinced that the two
primary reasons for disabling functionality this holds water.
1) If "some" applications break when seeing -1, then shouldn't those
applications get fixed, rather than globally disabling the functionality =
at
the platform level for all environments and applications?
2) The CPU (and bandwidth) impact of the CursorBlinkRate is miniscule =
if
the blink rate is set to a moderate pace. In addition, to the =
scalability
point, in our multi-farm Windows 2000 Terminal Services environment we
routinely have 250+ concurrent sessions per server, all with blinking
cursors.
To Joe's point earlier on the placement of the blinking cursor, it needs =
to
be enabled on the server, as any client side implementation, such as
Citrix's SpeedScreen, becomes a hassle to configure, and judging from
SpeedScreen, functionality/presentation-wise is marginal. SpeedScreen
was/is primarily a latency countermeasure anyway, not a bandwidth =
reduction
feature. As bandwidth and CPU usage really are non issues with the
CursorBlinkRate feature, I maintain that Server-side control of this
functionality should be enabled.
Thanks again for presenting this on behalf of the CCC (Concerned
CursorBlinkRate Community) ;-)
-----Original Message-----
From: Claudio Rodrigues [mailto:crodrigues@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]=3D20
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2004 9:40 AM
To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [THIN] Re: Cursor blink rate in Windows 2003...
Ok I talked with the developers on the TS group in Redmond last week.
Resuming their explanation: 1. Some applications go crazy when they see =
the
-1 setting to stop the cursor blinking (as we do on Windows 2000) so =
they
took this out on 2003 and simply ignore the > 0 setting in a TS session =
and
the cursor does not blink. 2. As you are aware of, the cursor blinking
requires timers what consume CPU cycles so there was also a scalability
factor on this decision. They are aware of the issue and it is on their
plate but I cannot say for sure if we will see a formal fix/patch for =
that
(I think we will) and they told me they have no idea on a timeframe for
this.
-----Original Message-----
From: Sjolund, Dag [mailto:Sjolund@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]=3D3D20
Sent: March 11, 2004 2:42 PM
To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [THIN] Re: Cursor blink rate in Windows 2003...
Brain, Claudio and Ron - In addition to all the other material you guys
contribute to the list, thanks for addressing this with the right folks.
Make sure they understand that it negatively impacts system navigation =
and
functionality for people with disabilities, and that it, as a result, =
should
not be a pure bandwidth consideration.
-----Original Message-----
From: Claudio Rodrigues =
[mailto:crodrigues@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]=3D3D3D20
Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2004 8:11 AM
To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [THIN] Re: Cursor blink rate in Windows 2003...
I will send the TS developers in Redmond an email today.
-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Madden [mailto:brian@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]=3D3D3D3D20
Sent: March 10, 2004 6:42 PM
To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [THIN] Re: Cursor blink rate in Windows 2003...
Ron, Claudio, and I will all be attending the MVP Conference in Redmond =
in
about three weeks. We'll be sure to ask the developers then.
Hopefully that's not too long of a wait!
Brian
Brian Madden
brian@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
+1.202.302.3657
Visit www.brianmadden.com for in-depth Citrix, Terminal Server, and
server-based computing news and analysis, white papers, downloadable =
videos,
and product reviews.
-----Original Message-----
From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On =
Behalf
Of Jeff Durbin
Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 6:36 PM
To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [THIN] Re: Cursor blink rate in Windows 2003...
Man, that's lame. Thanks Microsoft!=3D3D3D3D20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx=3D3D3D3D20 =3D3D3D
[mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
>On Behalf Of Sjolund, Dag
> Sent: Wednesday, 10 March 2004 4:57 p.m.
> To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [THIN] Cursor blink rate in Windows 2003... =3D3D3D3D20
>=3D3D3D3D20
> List Subscribers,
>=3D3D3D3D20
> In preparing for an upgrade of a Windows 2000 Server-based=3D3D3D3D20 =
=3D
=3D3D
=3D3D3D20
>terminal services farm to Windows 2003 Server, I have run=3D3D3D3D20 =
=3D
into=3D20
>=3D3D
an
=3D3D3D
>issue with the cursor blink functionality on the=3D3D3D3D20 Windows =
=3D3D
2003=3D3D3D20
>Server platform. After talking with Microsoft=3D3D3D3D20 Support, =
=3D3D
cursor=3D3D3D20
>blinking functionality is programmatically=3D3D3D3D20 disabled by =
design
on=3D3D3D20
>the Windows 2003 Server platform for=3D3D3D3D20 RDP sessions. This =
was
not=3D3D3D20
>the case on Windows 2000 and NT=3D3D3D3D20 4.0 based platforms. =3D3D
Microsoft's
=3D3D3D
>reasoning for this design=3D3D3D3D20 is likely anchored in the
historically=3D3D3D20
>well known issue of=3D3D3D3D20 bandwidth implications relating to a =
=3D3D
blinking
=3D3D3D
>cursor, coupled=3D3D3D3D20 with the desire to make RDP protocol as =3D
"thin"=3D20
>=3D3D
as
=3D3D3D
>possible by=3D3D3D3D20 default. Even though the cursor blink issue =
=3D3D
only=3D3D3D20
>had=3D3D3D3D20 bandwidth implications in certain environments, the =
=3D3D3D
global=3D3D3D3D20
> disabling of this "feature" has ramifications in =
environments=3D3D3D3D20=20
> =3D
=3D20
>where available bandwidth is a non-issue. Does anyone have=3D3D3D3D20 =
=3D
any
>connections with the right people at Microsoft to get=3D3D3D3D20 =3D
something
>like this addressed? I have an active case with MS=3D3D3D3D20 Support =
=3D
on=3D20
>this issue, though it is currently in a "We=3D3D3D3D20 can't/won't =3D
change=3D20
>this functionality" stage. The support rep is trying to address=20
>the=3D20 issue=3D3D3D3D20 through proper MS Support channels, but I=20
>figured I =3D
would
>try=3D3D3D3D20 to assist him with some help from this distinguished =
=3D
forum.
>=3D3D3D3D20 The cursor blink rate issue is a big one as it =
relates=3D20=20
>to=3D3D3D3D20 window/field navigation, especially for visually=3D20=20
>impaired=3D3D3D3D20 users, and though a minor detail configuration =
wise,=20
>=3D
>is a=3D3D3D3D20 show stopper for the overall solution. Someone =
with=3D20=20
>the=3D3D3D3D20 right connections please respond.....please.... Did =
I=3D20=20
>say=3D3D3D3D20 please? I'll attach an e-mail that I sent to MS=20
>Support=3D20 for=3D3D3D3D20 those who are really interested. For =
those=20
>who are=3D20 not,=3D3D3D3D20 sorry for temporarily taking up ~25K in =
your=20
>inbox. =3D3D3D3D20 Dag Sjolund, MCSE, CCNA, CCA, CISSP
> Senior Systems Engineer
> Best Western International, Inc.
>=3D3D3D3D20
> ______________________________________________________________
> __________
> _
>=3D3D3D3D20
> [MS Support Rep],
>=3D3D3D3D20
> The issue that we are experiencing with the CursorBlinkRate=3D3D3D3D20
> feature on Windows 2003 Server may have adverse =
implications=3D3D3D3D20
> on proceeding further with Windows 2003 Server-based =
Terminal=3D3D3D3D20
> Services implementations in our environment. Best Western=3D3D3D3D20
> International, Inc., THE WORLD'S LARGEST HOTEL CHAIN(r),=3D3D3D3D20
> currently utilize a multi-server, multi-farm Windows 2000=3D3D3D3D20
> Advanced Server Terminal Services solution to provide call=3D3D3D3D20
> center functionality for all Central Reservation Centers worldwide.
> =3D3D3D3D3D20
> Though potentially viewed as a minor detail in the overall=3D3D3D3D20
> solution, one of the vital requirements of this solution is=3D3D3D3D20
> for the call center agents to at all times be able to=3D3D3D3D20
> identify where in their call center applications they have=3D3D3D3D20
> navigated. This is especially true for agents that are=3D3D3D3D20
> visually impaired and/or have other physical challenges=3D3D3D3D20
> relating to mouse movements and keyboard operation. With =
the=3D3D3D3D20
> Windows 2000 Server platform this was a non-issue, as the=3D3D3D3D20
> cursor blink rate was a functional and adjustable setting,=3D3D3D3D20
> that could be tailored to the target Terminal Services environment.
> =3D3D3D3D3D20
> This brings us to the issue at hand: In Windows 2003, the=3D3D3D3D20
> cursor blink functionality has been globally disabled for =
the=3D3D3D3D20
> purpose of optimizing bandwidth usage of the RDP protocol =
and=3D3D3D3D20
> Terminal Services. As one can surmise, this means that =
even=3D3D3D3D20
> in scenarios were available bandwidth is not an issue, this=3D3D3D3D20
> feature cannot be enabled. In Best Western International's=3D3D3D3D20
> Terminal Services environment, cursor blinking has by =
design=3D3D3D3D20
> been enabled since the release of Windows NT 4.0 Terminal=3D3D3D3D20
> Server Edition, and is currently enabled in the Windows =
2000=3D3D3D3D20
> Server-based implementation. The Terminal Services=3D3D3D3D20
> environment spans multiple LAN/WAN architectures, including=3D3D3D3D20
> Dial-up modem connectivity, DSL/ADSL, Frame Relay circuits,=3D3D3D3D20
> T1/T3, and 100/1000Mb LAN segments. The individual servers=3D3D3D3D20
> routinely handle 250+ concurrent Terminal Services sessions=3D3D3D3D20
> without performance issues. At no point have we =
experienced=3D3D3D3D20
> issues relating to bandwidth usage as a result of the =
cursor=3D3D3D3D20
> blink feature.
> =3D3D3D3D3D20
> In summary, and judging from the numerous responses =
received=3D3D3D3D20
> from posts on newsgroups and other support forums on this=3D3D3D3D20
> topic, this issue is one that impacts decisions regarding =
the=3D3D3D3D20
> feasibility of Windows 2003 as a Terminal Services solution. =
=3D3D3D3D20
> The suggested behavior for the cursor blink feature would=3D3D3D3D20
> mirror the functionality on the Windows 2000 Server =
platform,=3D3D3D3D20
> but with one small adjustment: The cursor blink feature is=3D3D3D3D20
> enabled and adjustable, but the default behavior should be=3D3D3D3D20
> set to "no blinking" (-1).
> =3D3D3D3D3D20
> Please investigate if would be possible to submit this case=3D3D3D3D20
> as a justification for a patch or revision of the =
associated=3D3D3D3D20
> code. Below are details of the issue experienced. Let me=3D3D3D3D20
> know if you have any questions or concerns.
> =3D3D3D3D3D20
> Thanks,
> =3D3D3D3D3D20
> Dag Sjolund, MCSE, CCNA, CCA, CISSP
> Senior Systems Engineer
> Best Western International, Inc. - THE WORLD'S LARGEST =
HOTEL=3D3D3D3D20
> CHAIN(r) =3D3D3D3D3D20
>=3D3D3D3D20
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> ----------
> --------
>=3D3D3D3D20
> =3D3D3D3D3D20
> Summary of issue at hand:
>=3D3D3D3D20
> Platform: Windows 2003 Server Enterprise Edition with all=3D3D3D3D20
> updates, upgraded in place from Windows 2000 Advanced =
Server=3D3D3D3D20
> SP3. Running native Terminal Services (RDP 5.2).
>=3D3D3D3D20
> Symptoms: User profiles retained the pre-upgrade=3D3D3D3D20
> CursorBlinkRate settings, but cursor is not blinking at all. =
=3D3D3D3D20
> The users are able to change the Cursor blink rate setting=3D3D3D3D20
> Control Panel's Keyboard applet properties, but it has no=3D3D3D3D20
> actual effect on the blink rate. Cursor blinking and the=3D3D3D3D20
> functional adjustment of this value seems to be globally=3D3D3D3D20
> disabled. There are no "override" string values in the=3D3D3D3D20
> HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\Control\Terminal
> Server\WinStations\RDP-Tcp\UserOverride\Control Panel\Desktop key.
> Adding a "CursorBlinkRate" string value with a desired=3D3D3D3D20
> millisecond value in this key has no effect.
>=3D3D3D3D20
> =3D3D3D3D3D20
>=3D3D3D3D20
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