In a message dated 12/15/2005 8:55:06 P.M. Central Standard Time, EKOLAN1@xxxxxxx writes: I agree but who do we get to say who is qualified and who is not. The person picked to do the picking may be one you think is not qualified. We are back to square one The only thing we have to go on is who met the qualifications in the first place you know 10 years so many litters 4 champions. This is NOT foolproof but it's the best we got. Unless you can think of another way. Fred Fred: We already have many 10+4+4 judges, and I would not considered some judges who continuously put up incorrect dogs knowledgeable. Remember the locked hock debate? How many keep missing on that??? Too many. Not long ago a long time judge was trying to convince me that topline is defined mainly by a high wither..........hmmmm. Education and accountability are what is needed. A forum where judging results get dissected and evaluated by a group of peers. Lots of continuous training and seminars. But who wants to volunteer for that? <G> JMO Ileana ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://www.showgsd.org ============================================================================