[passcoalition] Re: Very Important, my BadFW: 7th Avenue and W 23 Street
- From: "Karen Gourgey" <kgourgey@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <passcoalition@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2011 00:29:13 -0400
Hi Annalyn,
Hope you're feeling better.
I hope I wasn't out of line with what PASS would have wanted me to say. I
got from Gene that in this situation, it might well be impossible to install
a new pole, so we at least wanted to have a fallback plan, which was putting
the APS on the right hand side (east side) of the pole. She did seem to
know that the situation wasn't good.
Karen
_____
From: passcoalition-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:passcoalition-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Annalyn
Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2011 10:10 PM
To: passcoalition@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [passcoalition] Re: Very Important, my BadFW: 7th Avenue and W 23
Street
I'm sorry I could not respond sooner, I have been sick and not looking at
email. Thank you Gene for your research. I would not assume DOT knows the
APS installation requirements as well as Gene. It's possible they are
simply responding to the requests from PASS at the April meeting. While
keeping a friendly tone has it's advantages, sometimes it may not hurt to
quote "chapter and verse." I'm always impressed when Gene does so.
Annalyn
-----Original Message-----
From: Karen Gourgey <karen.gourgey@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: 'passcoalition@xxxxxxxxxxxxx' <passcoalition@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wed, Jul 13, 2011 6:07 pm
Subject: [passcoalition] Re: Very Important, my BadFW: 7th Avenue and W 23
Street
Gene, thank you so much for checking this out!
As I understand it, where they are proposing to put the APS is practically
at the apex of the street and the avenue. And what we need to tell them is
A. that that aps has to be installed as far east as possible, away from 7th
avenue, and B. that we'll need spoken messages for both aps's. Makes sense
to me. Does anyone have any other thoughts?
Karen
Karen Luxton Gourgey Ed.D., Director
Computer Center for Visually Impaired People
Baruch College, City University of New York
One Bernard Baruch Way, Box H-0648
New York, NY 10010
Phone: (646) 312-1426
Fax: (646) 312-1421
<http://www.baruch.cuny.edu/ccvip/> http://www.baruch.cuny.edu/ccvip/
From: <mailto:passcoalition-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
passcoalition-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [
<mailto:passcoalition-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?>
mailto:passcoalition-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Gene Bourquin DHA
Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2011 3:31 PM
To: PASS listserv
Subject: [passcoalition] Re: Very Important, my BadFW: 7th Avenue and W 23
Street
I have been suspecting a problem, because I have watched as each pole has
been installed except the one on the south side of the eat crosswalk.
bThese kind of infrastructure problems are not uncommon, but I'm not sure
their proposal is the best idea.
I went and took picture a while ago and took some rough measurements. The
APSs will be optimally placed at all corners except this one, but the
proposed installation does not comply with the MUTCD 2009. The pole that
DOT proposes is at the very edge of the east crosswalk closest the the
center of the intersections. This puts it far beyond the 5 feet allowed
from the crosswalk furthest from the center of the intersection. This
placement violates the MUTCD 4E.08 and 4E.09 as I understand them. Here is
the relevant rec:
Placement may be: "Between the edge of the crosswalk line (extended)
farthest from the center of the intersection and the side of a curb ramp (if
present), but not greater than 5 feet from said crosswalk line"
Not only is the placement poor for blind travelers, it is also very poor for
wheelchair users and people with physical disabilities. After activating
the ped button, travelers will need to walk past the entire crosswalk for
east-bound pedestrians and try to find the correct place to begin a crossing
to go north.
What we might propose or ask:
- Is it possible to mount a pole anywhere within five feet of the crosswalk
line FURTHEST from the center of the intersections s the ?
If this is absolutely impossible, and they must use the existing pole, then:
- the APS must be mounted on the east side of the pole (not the 7th Ave.
side)
- the DOT must understand that the arrow is not sufficient to indicate the
direction on the signal and will be infrequently referenced by blind
travelers without a hearing loss
- the APS will require spoken messages for both APS on the southeast
corner, indicating the street where the walk sign is on
I look forward to hearing others' input on this.
Gene
Dr. Eugene A Bourquin
_____________________________
DHA, COMS, CI & CT, CLVT
Support deafblind children in Guatemala!
Go to <http://www.friendsoffundal.org/> www.FRIENDSofFUNDAL.org
Visit: <http://www.bourquinconsulting.com/>
http://www.bourquinconsulting.com/
> From: <mailto:karen.gourgey@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
karen.gourgey@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> To: <mailto:passcoalition@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> passcoalition@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [passcoalition] Very Important, my BadFW: 7th Avenue and W 23
Street
> Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2011 17:19:12 +0000
>
> Don't know how I completely missed this message. Comments very much
appreciated, so that I can write back to her.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Karen
>
>
> Karen Luxton Gourgey Ed.D., Director
> Computer Center for Visually Impaired People
> Baruch College, City University of New York
> One Bernard Baruch Way, Box H-0648
> New York, NY 10010
> Phone: (646) 312-1426
> Fax: (646) 312-1421
> <http://www.baruch.cuny.edu/ccvip/> http://www.baruch.cuny.edu/ccvip/
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Forgione, Margaret <mailto:%5bmailto:mforgione@xxxxxxxxxxx%5d>
[mailto:mforgione@xxxxxxxxxxx]
> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2011 4:08 PM
> To: Karen Gourgey
> Cc: Chattergoon, Colleen
> Subject: 7th Avenue and W 23 Street
>
> Karen,
>
> Hello and hope you are well. I wanted to make you aware of a change that
we had to make at 7th/23rd due to subsurface conditions that we found during
installation.
>
> Due to subsurface conditions we were unable to install a new signal pole
on the south curb of the southeast corner of the intersection. We had
planned to install this pole adjacent to the ramp so the APS would be within
easy reach for the east leg crossing of W 23rd Street. Instead we will
install this APS on an existing pole which (not ideally) is closer to the
pedestrian ramp for the crossing of Seventh Avenue. The vibrating tactile
arrow will still point toward 23rd Street. The APS for the crossing of
Seventh Avenue will not be on the same pole but rather on a new pole being
installed in the pedestrian refuge island in excess of 10 feet west of the
southeast corner.
>
> Please let me know if this makes sense.
>
> Thanks, Margaret
>
>
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>
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