[passcoalition] Re: Very Important, my BadFW: 7th Avenue and W 23 Street
- From: Gene Bourquin DHA <oandmhk@xxxxxxx>
- To: PASS listserv <passcoalition@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2011 18:24:35 -0400
Karen, that's essentially correct, but Margaret's email makes it fairly clear
that they probably will not find another place to locate the APS. The existing
pole is actually not at the apex, but even further away from the optimum
location. It is at the most-southern edge of the rounded portion of the corner
close to the edge of the south crosswalk line that extends to the cut-through,
furthest from the center of the intersection. In fact, if the pedestrian plaza
were not there, this pole would be the place for the south crosswalk APS.
I think it would be good to ask the question, Is there any place within 5 feet
of the appropriate crosswalk line for the APS. it probably won't do any good.
From the DOT email it seems they are already very aware this it should be there
but it cannot.
Gene
Dr. Eugene
A Bourquin
_____________________________
DHA, COMS, CI & CT,
CLVT
Support deafblind children in Guatemala!
Go to www.FRIENDSofFUNDAL.org
Visit: http://www.bourquinconsulting.com/
From: karen.gourgey@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
To: passcoalition@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [passcoalition] Re: Very Important, my BadFW: 7th Avenue and W 23
Street
Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2011 22:05:44 +0000
Gene, thank you so much for checking this out! As I understand it, where they
are proposing to put the APS is practically at the apex of the street and the
avenue. And what we need to tell them is A. that that aps has to be installed
as far east as possible, away from 7th avenue, and B. that we’ll need spoken
messages for both aps’s. Makes sense to me. Does anyone have any other
thoughts? Karen Karen Luxton Gourgey Ed.D., Director
Computer Center for Visually Impaired People
Baruch College, City University of New York
One Bernard Baruch Way, Box H-0648
New York, NY 10010
Phone: (646) 312-1426
Fax: (646) 312-1421
http://www.baruch.cuny.edu/ccvip/From: passcoalition-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:passcoalition-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Gene Bourquin DHA
Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2011 3:31 PM
To: PASS listserv
Subject: [passcoalition] Re: Very Important, my BadFW: 7th Avenue and W 23
Street I have been suspecting a problem, because I have watched as each pole
has been installed except the one on the south side of the eat crosswalk.
bThese kind of infrastructure problems are not uncommon, but I'm not sure their
proposal is the best idea. I went and took picture a while ago and took some
rough measurements. The APSs will be optimally placed at all corners except
this one, but the proposed installation does not comply with the MUTCD 2009.
The pole that DOT proposes is at the very edge of the east crosswalk closest
the the center of the intersections. This puts it far beyond the 5 feet
allowed from the crosswalk furthest from the center of the intersection. This
placement violates the MUTCD 4E.08 and 4E.09 as I understand them. Here is the
relevant rec: Placement may be: "Between the edge of the crosswalk line
(extended) farthest from the center of the intersection and the side of a curb
ramp (if present), but not greater than 5 feet from said crosswalk line" Not
only is the placement poor for blind travelers, it is also very poor for
wheelchair users and people with physical disabilities. After activating the
ped button, travelers will need to walk past the entire crosswalk for
east-bound pedestrians and try to find the correct place to begin a crossing to
go north. What we might propose or ask:- Is it possible to mount a pole
anywhere within five feet of the crosswalk line FURTHEST from the center of the
intersections s the ? If this is absolutely impossible, and they must use the
existing pole, then:- the APS must be mounted on the east side of the pole
(not the 7th Ave. side)- the DOT must understand that the arrow is not
sufficient to indicate the direction on the signal and will be infrequently
referenced by blind travelers without a hearing loss- the APS will require
spoken messages for both APS on the southeast corner, indicating the street
where the walk sign is on I look forward to hearing others' input on this.
Gene
Dr. Eugene A Bourquin
_____________________________
DHA, COMS, CI & CT, CLVT
Support deafblind children in Guatemala!
Go to www.FRIENDSofFUNDAL.org Visit: http://www.bourquinconsulting.com/ > From:
karen.gourgey@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> To: passcoalition@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [passcoalition] Very Important, my BadFW: 7th Avenue and W 23 Street
> Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2011 17:19:12 +0000
>
> Don't know how I completely missed this message. Comments very much
> appreciated, so that I can write back to her.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Karen
>
>
> Karen Luxton Gourgey Ed.D., Director
> Computer Center for Visually Impaired People
> Baruch College, City University of New York
> One Bernard Baruch Way, Box H-0648
> New York, NY 10010
> Phone: (646) 312-1426
> Fax: (646) 312-1421
> http://www.baruch.cuny.edu/ccvip/
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Forgione, Margaret [mailto:mforgione@xxxxxxxxxxx]
> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2011 4:08 PM
> To: Karen Gourgey
> Cc: Chattergoon, Colleen
> Subject: 7th Avenue and W 23 Street
>
> Karen,
>
> Hello and hope you are well. I wanted to make you aware of a change that we
> had to make at 7th/23rd due to subsurface conditions that we found during
> installation.
>
> Due to subsurface conditions we were unable to install a new signal pole on
> the south curb of the southeast corner of the intersection. We had planned to
> install this pole adjacent to the ramp so the APS would be within easy reach
> for the east leg crossing of W 23rd Street. Instead we will install this APS
> on an existing pole which (not ideally) is closer to the pedestrian ramp for
> the crossing of Seventh Avenue. The vibrating tactile arrow will still point
> toward 23rd Street. The APS for the crossing of Seventh Avenue will not be on
> the same pole but rather on a new pole being installed in the pedestrian
> refuge island in excess of 10 feet west of the southeast corner.
>
> Please let me know if this makes sense.
>
> Thanks, Margaret
>
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