Oracle really does need to provide a licensing FAQ and tutorial... perhaps even a training course! It's amazing how hard it is to get specific information about what's covered and what's not. I think the difficulty here may lie with the fact that yes, you can install and run grid control without the diagnostics packs (et al), but you can't do much with it. I believe that there is something in the install documentation for OEM that discusses whether grid control is included or not - my recollection is that grid control is included with the database, but not useful without the packs. -Jackie Jackie D. Brock Database Specialist - Systems Evaluation CableLabs(r) 858 Coal Creek Circle Louisville, CO 80027 Email: j.brock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 303-661-3347 -- //www.freelists.org/webpage/oracle-l